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Extend 63 Bus to Honor Oak Park Station?
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hopper


Posts: 65
Joined: Jan 2008
Post: #1
17-03-2008 02:53 PM

Does anyone know if there is a reason that no buses go from central London to Honor Oak Park station? Why does the 63 (which is billed as an "Honor Oak" bus) stop halfway up Peckham Rye rather than going up the hill and round the corner to the station?

I thought TfL were into their integrated transport, so it seems odd that we've only got the P4/P12 which are local services, stopping outside. I know the 171/172 are available on Brockley Rise but both routes takes ages from central London compared with the 63.

Do TfL not want double deckers going over the railway bridge or something. If anyone knows the answer I'd be interested to hear.

Thanks

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #2
17-03-2008 02:58 PM

I would imagine having just alighed at Honor Oak Station from Town the local services , ie P4 , are what is required.
I agree not that many buses pass the station but is is not an arterial road like the 205 at FH

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Tersie


Posts: 272
Joined: Feb 2007
Post: #3
17-03-2008 04:17 PM

I have also found the 63 bus a bit strange and I have also wondered why it does not come all the way to Honor Oak station. It would be great if it terminated at Brockley Rise or Forest Hill instead. However would anyone use this bus if it started in Forest Hill or Brockley Rise?

http://www.londonbusroutes.net/times/063.htm

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Baboonery


Posts: 581
Joined: Sep 2007
Post: #4
17-03-2008 05:21 PM

You've got to think about practicalities as well. If it followed the 363 route down Wood Vale and into Forest Hill it would have to terminate somewhere convenient, somewhere either quiet or with lots of space, or preferably both. There's nowhere suitable in FH, with relatively narrow roads and bottleneck-tastic traffic. A London road terminus would be a nightmare. Also, it needs to turn round, and you couldn't do this without going down Dartmouth Road at least as far as Sydenham or round the Catford one way system, whereas the junction of Wood Vale and FH Road has been redesigned for the purpose.

Also, a doubling of bus traffic down Wood Vale or HO Road mightn't go down too well with the residents. Though the extra wear on the road and facing buildings may uncover some remnant of the Moore Park Tavern.

I'm less familiar with the road layout in the 'SE4 borders' bit of SE23, but it doesn't look that promising there either.

I'd certainly use a bus that began at the Wetherspoon's, say, and then basically ran like the 363 (particularly on Sundays when I have to go into town and the BLOODY TRAINS ARE OFF), but I'm not sure how you'd do it.

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Perryman


Posts: 809
Joined: Dec 2006
Post: #5
17-03-2008 11:19 PM

" There's nowhere suitable in FH, with relatively narrow roads and bottleneck-tastic traffic. A London road terminus would be a nightmare."

Well the 171 used to terminate in FH ~10 years ago.
Westbourne Drive via Church vale was the turn around area.
Sometimes, buses still use Westboune Drive as a waiting area, as it is easily wide enough.

This probably explains why there are 2 cafes opposite each other at the junction with Waldram Pk Rd

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thenutfield


Posts: 235
Joined: Nov 2007
Post: #6
17-03-2008 11:42 PM

Perryman Wrote:
"

Well the 171 used to terminate in FH ~10 years ago.

ahh the 171. i remember getting on at Westbourne Drive and waiting for the driver and conductor (probably in one of the caffs). Is my memory failing me, or did it used to take me all the way to Islington, back in the 70's?

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multisync


Posts: 26
Joined: Nov 2007
Post: #7
18-03-2008 11:41 AM

There used to be a 176a or 176b which used to take you from Westbourne Drive to Cannon Street as well and the 124 used to stop at the same place,long time ago though probably in the 70's

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hopper


Posts: 65
Joined: Jan 2008
Post: #8
18-03-2008 11:41 AM

To be honest I'm not worried about Forest Hill, which already has two services (176 and 185) from central London. It's Honor Oak that's missing it and I don't understand why a service that bills itself as Honor Oak isn't going to the station or anywhere near the "centre".

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T and C


Posts: 22
Joined: Mar 2008
Post: #9
18-03-2008 01:40 PM

how long does the 171 to central london take approx? I hear it goes to elephant & castle and holborn? I am also interested to know what bus routes are availble in HOP.

Are the trains really usually closed on Sundays?

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #10
18-03-2008 01:42 PM

No trains not closed on Sundays. Not sure who put this scare out.
Occasional there is engineering work and the service may be restricted and partly bus subsitute

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Baboonery


Posts: 581
Joined: Sep 2007
Post: #11
18-03-2008 03:06 PM

"Occasionally engineering works"?!

I'm sorry, I think that massively underestimates the frequency and scale of disruption to the northbound train service on Sundays, and does a disservice to anyone who's thinking of moving here. Currently, a disrupted or totally non-existent northbound service is more frequent than a normal Sunday service (in the last 26 weeks by my count, it's 8 with no trains, 6 with reduced service, 6 normal and 6 when I've been away and haven't checked).

And Southern's advice is not to take a replacement bus service (is there one?), but to travel via East Croydon. Paying the extra, obviously.

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #12
18-03-2008 03:09 PM

I am sorry I thought they would have had a replacement bus service.
If they are advising you to travel to East Croydon and back are you sure you have to pay the fare to EC. I would have thought you can buy ticket simply HOP to LB .

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SophieBee


Posts: 46
Joined: Oct 2007
Post: #13
18-03-2008 03:34 PM

T and C Wrote:
how long does the 171 to central london take approx? I hear it goes to elephant & castle and holborn? I am also interested to know what bus routes are availble in HOP.


The time the 171 takes varies depending on the time of day, but it seems slower than the 172 to get to Elephant & Castle. I get the 172 every day now rather than the train, which gets me to Covent Garden in about 50 minutes at rush hour - only about 10-15 minutes longer than when I would take the train (and I get a seat all the way there). I could also get the 171 as they both go to Aldwych, but have found that the 172 is much quicker as it doesn't go through Peckham and Camberwell.

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T and C


Posts: 22
Joined: Mar 2008
Post: #14
18-03-2008 04:19 PM

HOPE THIS HELPS :
[b]For London Bus Routes & Timetables nr HOP: [/b]

171 : http://www.londonbusroutes.net/times/171N171.htm
(Catford - Tottenham Court Road via E&C, Waterloo, Holborn)

172 : http://www.londonbusroutes.net/times/172.htm
(Brockley Rise - St Pauls Station via Elephant Castle/Waterloo)

63 : http://www.londonbusroutes.net/times/063.htm
(Honor Oak/Forest Hill Tavern - Kings Cross)

P4 : http://www.londonbusroutes.net/times/P04.htm
(Lewisham - Brixton via Honor Oak)

P12: http://www.londonbusroutes.net/times/P12.htm
(Brockley Rise - Surrey Quays)

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Tersie


Posts: 272
Joined: Feb 2007
Post: #15
20-03-2008 11:35 AM

Back to the 63 route - why can't the bus start from its current Terminus and come over the hill to the Honor Oak Park, loop round Brockley Rise (where the 172 currently stops) and stop on Honor Oak Park before heading back on its route towards Kings Cross? This detour would only take a matter of minutes and would serve us at Honor Oak. At least he destination on the front of the bus would be more accurate!

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hopper


Posts: 65
Joined: Jan 2008
Post: #16
20-03-2008 01:43 PM

I couldn't agree more - that's exactly the logical place for it to end. Actually in the centre of Honor Oak rather than 15mins walk away, up an enormous hill!

I might start lobbying TfL to find out if it's practical for the route to be extended by half a mile.

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T and C


Posts: 22
Joined: Mar 2008
Post: #17
20-03-2008 01:56 PM

well it seems TFL do need to be notified in anycase. Perhaps a petition may help? Has anyone ever contacted TFL with this kind of request before?

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michael


Posts: 3,215
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #18
20-03-2008 02:18 PM

I have attending meetings with TfL and the bus companies in the past. Usually I do not have much to say about buses but this proposal sounds very sensible. So I will ask at the next meeting about extending the 63 buses from Wood Vale up to Honor Oak Park and allow them to terminate at Brockley Rise or just turn around at Brockley Rise.

The advantage is that extending this route would connect with other bus routes including the P4 and 171 as well as the frequent train services from HOP to London Bridge and on the East London Extension.

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Applespider


Posts: 283
Joined: Feb 2006
Post: #19
20-03-2008 02:45 PM

The only problem with that solution would be with the N63 which takes up the daytime 363 route from Wood Vale. Would you suggest that the N63 go down the hill, round Brockley Rise, back up and then along Wood Vale?

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davidl


Posts: 180
Joined: Oct 2007
Post: #20
20-03-2008 03:09 PM

I agree that connecting to HOP is a good idea.

Quote:
I have attending meetings with TfL and the bus companies in the past. Usually I do not have much to say about buses


I don't suppose you might also be able to raise the fact that drivers tend to chuck everyone off the bus halfway up the hill rather than at the (current) terminus - this seems wrong to me...

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