SE23 Forum

Hi Maggie
I do not think I commented on the state of Willow Way. The fact no willow's is hardly relavent. How often do you see Lord Dartmouth in DR.
I know currently a dump but I assume the council , in their wisdom , would tart the area up if they went ahead.
I am not pro WW or DR but seems the council say the costs in WW would be so much less as the council tax payers would get a refund if went ahead in WW.
I do think that Louise House and the front of the old pool are not worth saving , but only my opinion. I would prefer they are pulled town and the area turned into gardens for the council tax payers.

To be fair, the current site at DR isn't exactly a bed of roses at the moment either!

I also walked past WW the other day to try and visualise a new pool. It would appear the the frontage of the pool would be very visible from Kirkdale (and indeed the Kirkdale end of WW, where the Tesco Express is being built), as it would appear the entrance corner would be around 20 yards from Kirkdale on the point that WW juts out a bit). Admittedly the walk from the Bricklayers isn't as impressive, although I think they may be able to make it more visible from this junction depending on the height and which buildings are demolished to make way for it.

Keep Swimming in Forest Hill

Well, the petition calling for the retention of the pools in Dartmouth Road continues to grow - 4,776 signatures known to date with several sets of petition forms still out there awaiting collection.

Four thousand seven hundred and seventy six people have signed to retain the pools in Dartmouth Road[/b]!

Quetta

Quetta
I have signed as well despite my doubts.

Well, good for you, Brian.

That makes 4,777!

Quetta

Brian, re-spell your name. Good on you.

4777 people signing despite their doubts. Must be some sort of record.

Well my children and and their friends would prefer a pool 7.5 minutes walk from the old site in 2012 rather than wait till 2015. At least then they will be able to return to swimming locally before they have all reached school leaving age.

Well, can't say I really expected them to say, "Daddy, I respect the value of the Victorian frontage and, as delayed gratification is a sign of maturity, I'll forego my childish impulses and forego the lazy alternative currently proposed and fight to keep something special in Forest Hill town centre."

Then again, kids are older than their years these days

I did the walk between the two sites on Sunday. It took me 9 minutes at what I regard as a leisurely pace, others who I was walking with took a bit longer, taking 11 minutes. I am sure I could do the walk in 7.5 minutes, but not with children or a buggy, and certainly not when carrying bags of towels and swimming costumes for children.

For most people in SE23 this site is not 9 minutes away, it is 9 minutes further away, double the distance for many people. While others will have to walk for over half and hour each way, through to town centre, out the other side, into an industrial estate and eventually to the pool.

I have no desire to wait until 2015 for swimming in Forest Hill, SE23 or SE26. However, I still believe there is a possibility of Willow Way cross-subsidising the existing pool site rather than the other way round, this is why I am supporting http://keepswimming.notlong.com

Also known as another minute in a car and an entire two more stops on a bus.

Of course, under the vile Bullock's Forest Hill hating campaign, everyone will be forced to walk to the pool and the use of private or public wheeled transport will be banned.

Disingenuous with a capital D, I'm afraid.

Michael:

Aha - we've cracked the mayor's cunning plan at last!

It looks like all these extra walkers will have to go through Forest Hill town centre and past the shops in Dartmouth Rd. Sounds like a brilliant business opportunity there for the shops to supply drinks, snacks, caf?s stops etc for all the people on route and in need of sustenance for their extra 6-9 minute journey!

But seriously, the mayor needs to look at Lewisham as a whole, not just those who live in north Forest Hill. There are also plenty of people who would find the new location (which surely, once developed, wouldn't be termed as a derogatory 'industrial site'!) closer, or equidistant, from the current delapidated site.

Finally - serious question for those who have signed the petition or who face a longer walk: If extra funding is not realised, would you rather wait till 2015 for the possibility that some funds may become available or would you be willing to pay an extra localised Council Tax levy for the next few years to fund the building of the pools on the current site?

I was given to understand that our Lord Mayor lived in Tyson Road , Forest Hill. Of course I was probably given incorrect info but if true not sure he is a FH Hater. Guess he now lives in Blackheath, does anyone know?
Someone called Willow Lane an Industrial Estate, they obviously have not been to one. This is one gated area without 5 titchy storage units plus couple of other delelict blocks.
The two sides here just will not compromise one centimetre . Some want a pool sooner than later others to preserve buildings of dubious quality. But everyone entilted to their opinions.
The LBC probably cheering all the way as they can keep delaying funding because of local disagreements.

For someone who is going swimming to presumably keep fit another few metres walk probably not a minus. Anyway then nearer to those in Upper Sydenham.
I voted for pool retention in DR but would have no problem if they pulled down existing building plus LH if cheaper.

Are either side prepared to compromise. Having said that not sure what.
Perhaps we could all agree to go back to the council and say although not our first choice what are the costs and finish dates for building on existing site and demolishing the old building completely. I would like to demolish LH but understand EH would not approve.

Go on folks compromise.

Although 4000 plus have voted for pool in DR ( with facade of old building ) I would guess if everyone in FH and Upper Sydenham were asked WW would win, but of course could be wrong.

I'd like to be given the choice rather than simply be told "it's unaffordable".

As a swimmer living in FH ward, I'd like, for selfish reasons, there to be a good quality pool nearer to my house than The Bridge as soon as possible. But as a Lewisham citizen and taxpayer, I'd like the net cost to the council of such a pool to be as small as possible. Otherwise money will be unnecessarily diverted from the other equally (at least) valuable services which the council provides. The Willow Way option seems to me to meet these criteria best. So I have not signed the petition.

Compromise?
The reason we (SE23) still have no pools is because of compromise.
We have compromised from the very start and while the council continually see movement, they will, inch by inch, take us to their original position which is no pools and the site sold off to the highest bidder.

From the start we should had all stuck to our guns and stated clearly that we want the pools made safe and operational as priority no 1 before we talked of any longer term plans.
The reality was, once the pools were closed, half the battle was lost.

Willows way is nothing but a stalking horse option - it is a vote for 'well a few minutes extra car journey is not so bad; having to catch a bus to the pools is not so bad' .
Once those points are thought to be conceded, it is a very short step for the council to ask that we stay on the road just a few more stops and use one of the existing pools.

Realistically, I think there is minimal chance of a new pool, especially in this recession. The compromise position is for the council to repair the pools and we'll all try to forget the last 2 years ever happened.

Perryman repairing the pools would be a great option but is it possible.

Have things got too bad and beyond repair. Does anyone know.

I thought the reason for rebuilding the pools from scratch, was because it was deemed too expensive to patch up - the tanks down below had cracked and would require some major surgery. Apparently not something that could be easily fixed - or so we have been led to believe.

I share Perryman' s pessimism about Lewisham Council. The Council, correctly, regards the Dartmouth Road site as a valuable and saleable asset and Willow Way as worthless by comparision. Consequently a pool will be built on Willow Way regardless of the views of local people and the appropriateness of the site in respect of a leisure centre.

The Council will obtain a fig leaf of political respectability for its Willow Way decision by briefing an opinion polling company to provide a result favourable to Willow Way. It will also skew its consultation procedure in favour of Willow Way.

All independent petitions and protestations from local people concerning the Dartmouth Road site will ultimately be disregarded by the narrow reductive minds which are in control at Lewisham Council.

Just like SFFH skewed its consultation in in favour of retaining the old building and KSIFH skews its petition by not being named honestly. Keep Swimming In One Bit Of Forest Hill In One Existing Building And Prioritise This Over All Other Factors would be more honest, but KSIOBOFHIOEBAPTOAOF is not quite as snappy or as dramatic.