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Pedestrian crossing by WH Smith's
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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #1
12-07-2008 12:16 PM

Am I the only one who is upset by the timing of the lights at this major crossing. Seems totally to favour of the motorist ( most of whom do not live locally ).
At busy times there are too many people trapped in the middle.
Surely pedestrians should take precedence over people who cannot seem to get out of their car.
Could we not push for single crossing as it used to be years ago.

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Perryman


Posts: 809
Joined: Dec 2006
Post: #2
13-07-2008 01:54 AM

No, you are not alone in being concerned, Brian - these lights have been out of sync for a few years now and it is a dangerous situation.

Anyone new to the crossing invariably steps out into the traffic after waiting their turn, only to scuttle back confused.

Locals, battle hardened with years of experience of dealing with the likes of

  • the Honor Oak Rd Tesco "double jeopardy" crossing of death,
  • the Top Gear approved Perry Vale track,
  • the Davewhiting "Gordian knot" of crossings at Kangley Bridge,
etc
know to ignore the signals but just look for gaps and drivers that look like they may be slow off the blocks.

This is less than ideal.

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #3
13-07-2008 09:22 AM

Thanks Perryman
I do think we have reached the point that there are on occasions too many people for the middle island to accomodate , especially when peopke coming in one direction try to get past the ones coming from the other.
Also especially the cars coming from Dartmouth Rd to Devonshire Rd , just before pedestrians are allowed over , usually run the red lights.
I expect we are wasting our time as this is a TFL crossing not LBC ( do not mean the c**p radio station ) , but will e mail TFL anyway.

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Applespider


Posts: 283
Joined: Feb 2006
Post: #4
13-07-2008 12:46 PM

Agree entirely. They're really not particularly useful for pedestrians and it can be downright dangerous if someone sees their train and tries to belt for it (although with the gates they might miss it anyhow!)

I did raise this a few years ago and was told (surprise surprise) that we should cross at the bank (no island) and walk up the other side of the road which I suppose does have the benefit of avoiding the Honor Oak crossing but is less than ideal if you actually want to go to the Sainsburys side of the road - and don't get me started on the crossing outside Sainsburys which seems to hold pedestrians for a full minute once the button is pushed regardless of the traffic situation (e.g. it's already queued, there's not much of it etc)

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foxe


Posts: 53
Joined: Apr 2008
Post: #5
14-07-2008 10:23 AM

Hang on chaps. Remember we're talking about the south circular here. It's a very busy road which already has too many traffic lights, delays and other nusiances. There are crossings by Co-op, WH Smiths, Sainsbury's, Cummin-Up all within half a mile. Why aren't we criticising lazy pedestrians who can't walk a few extra feet and cross somewhere else?

I would favour the increased use of the Barclay's crossing and taking out the other lights althogether and let the traffic move around that bend instead of it sitting there choking the residents of forest hill.

Why would this be unpopular? because lazy obese members of the public don't want to walk a couple of extra metres up the hill. Sad fact....

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #6
14-07-2008 11:25 AM

Oh dear I have upset a motorist. Surely compaining about pedestrians walking a few extra metres in the pot calling the kettkle black as far as most motorist are concerned.
If I want to go from W H Smith and Son to Abbey you seem to be suggesting going up London Rd to Sainsbury the coming down again.

How about diverting the S Circular to reclaim F Hill. From Catford could go up Brockley Rise , HOPR then HOR . Think how nice FH could be.

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Baboonery


Posts: 581
Joined: Sep 2007
Post: #7
14-07-2008 11:35 AM

If the inability to park on the south circ brings shopkeepers out in a fit of bedwetting and mass closures, imagine what isolating the north-west side of the T junction would be like if you couldn't get there on foot. And of course, all the Dartmouth Road shops would die because it'd be impossible to turn right from London Road into Dartmouth Road. Or would it? I imagine there'd be quite a queue, which would, you know, choke the residents of Forest Hill, though they probably wouldn't be there because their town centre has now become a playground for the Clarkson tendency and they've all nicked off somewhere else.

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foxe


Posts: 53
Joined: Apr 2008
Post: #8
14-07-2008 11:36 AM

There speaks a pedestrian not prepared to walk a few extra metres....

Perhaps you should bank on-line?

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #9
14-07-2008 11:51 AM

Let us try to get back to the point.
There are often too many people in the middle island for the space trying to get by people in the wrong direction.
I am happy to walk a few metres. I always walk journeys of up to 2 miles even when I had a car . I do bank on line but trying to think of older persons and handicapped.

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NewForester


Posts: 377
Joined: Feb 2008
Post: #10
14-07-2008 11:59 AM

Over 90% of the traffic turns right up London Road, so why not narrow the South Circular so that it is only one lane in each direction? There would be plenty of space for a large, central island and you'd stop those people who use the inside lane to turn right, cutting up all the other drivers and nearly getting crushed by the lorries. Win win?

Alternatively, the Forest Hill Urban Design Framework and Development Strategy proposed significant changes to this junction in 2003 (see p33), but the only things which seem to have been implemented are the building projects Sad

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foxe


Posts: 53
Joined: Apr 2008
Post: #11
14-07-2008 12:17 PM

When they redesign the station perhaps they could extend the underpass so that pedestrains can go under the road and cars across the road? win win?

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #12
14-07-2008 12:37 PM

Two interesting suggestions , we could pedestrianise Dartmouth Road, or certainly the station end. This would be win win. Buses could easily be diverted as they were when major road works recently.
True major bus stop for 197 and 176 would move to junction of Sydenham Rise and 122 would go the same route but down London Rd.

Wow what a great idea. Why has not TFL thought of this. We could have pavement cafe's by Dartmouth Arms.

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Jane


Posts: 52
Joined: Jan 2007
Post: #13
14-07-2008 12:51 PM

As one of those who emerges from Dartmouth Road in a car, I agree that the pedestrian crossing is dangerous and an accident waiting to happen - the number of pedestrians can really build up and inevitably they start trying to beat the traffic when drivers (sorry) have the right of way. Perhaps the period allowed for them to cross should be longer?
The main problem with the Dartmouth Road exit is drivers blocking the mouth of the road en route up the South Circular. Sometimes the traffic builds up a long way back down Dartmouth Road and only one or two cars can squeeze out (if at all). Also, drivers block the entrance to the station which means cars come to a halt approaching the pedestrian crossing.
Perhaps more use should be made of yellow boxes to deter this behaviour. "Keep clear" seems to be frequently ignored and unfortunately some irresponsible drivers get very impatient and vent their frustration by driving too fast across the junction thereby playing cat and mouse with the pedestrians.
An underpass would be great but doubt there's much chance of that.

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Applespider


Posts: 283
Joined: Feb 2006
Post: #14
14-07-2008 01:43 PM

Quote:
Perhaps you should bank on-line?


Unfortunately they won't let me print off my own banknotes though! Wink

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Baboonery


Posts: 581
Joined: Sep 2007
Post: #15
14-07-2008 02:13 PM

Two interesting suggestions , we could pedestrianise Dartmouth Road, or certainly the station end. This would be win win. Buses could easily be diverted as they were when major road works recently.
True major bus stop for 197 and 176 would move to junction of Sydenham Rise and 122 would go the same route but down London Rd.

Wow what a great idea. Why has not TFL thought of this. We could have pavement cafe's by Dartmouth Arms.


Hmm, I wonder what the residents would think of that. Their bus service slashed and lots of noise at night...

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reverendlionelblair


Posts: 47
Joined: Apr 2008
Post: #16
16-07-2008 09:34 PM

Pedestrianising Dartmouth Road would be fantastic, it would mean I could still cycle, the baby would get less smog and the shops might all stay open as oppose to closing down, best suggestion I've heard for ages.

Someone should also open a roof garden restaurant on the top of the old bank near the old Post Office. That would be brilliant, would really put FH on the map a bit.

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thenutfield


Posts: 235
Joined: Nov 2007
Post: #17
16-07-2008 11:19 PM

pedestrianise Dartmouth Road?
roof top garden?

have I died and woken up in some weird alternative dimension?

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foxe


Posts: 53
Joined: Apr 2008
Post: #18
17-07-2008 09:45 AM

Don't worry nutfield - you're not in an alternative reality - the roof top restaurant will be a fried chicken place....

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petersutton01


Posts: 21
Joined: May 2008
Post: #19
25-07-2008 03:21 PM

Wow Brian.....A Forest Hill without the south circular.....can you imagine.....quite roads, clean(er) air, summer street parties....almost makes Forest Hill seem idillic!

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #20
25-07-2008 04:02 PM

Yes great would it not be.

Perry Vale has been is idyllic , a pastoral utopia , another eden , since traffic banned. I dread the day the infernal combustion engine reappears.

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