Today I happened upon a petition (Via the Sydenham forum) to return the Southern service to the original 4 trains per hour.
This makes sense to me as this year I've found the Overground service the fullest I've ever known it with people unable to board at HOP and it being quite a squeeze to get onto some carriages even at Forest hill.
Here's the link
https://www.change.org/p/reinstate-the-s...don-bridge

Signed.

Reaching almost 2,400 signatures as of the morning of 4 March 2023.

Signed also. Fingers crossed the effort makes a difference.

thank-you both.
As this forum gets limited footfall I would suggest sharing the link to local friends and neighbours as I have done.
We really as a community need to make ourselves heard.

Before we had the Overground we had 6 trains an hour to London Bridge. They were so frequent I never looked at a timetable.

And there were trains that ran to Charing X which would really help with access into central London.
my personal bugbear is that Canada Water was just not built with current passenger numbers in mind for the Overground interchange to Jubilee.
The only way to avoid what feels like an accident waiting to happen on the overcrowded down escalator to the jubilee platforms is to go up and over then down from the ticket hall (a route I personally choose due to being unsteady on my feet at times and getting anxious in crowds).
The Elizabeth line is our other option to travel into central london but to do so involves going out of ones way to do so (It adds approximately 15mins to my commute if I choose that option).
I feel at the very least it would benefit our community if they returned for the 4 trains an hour on the London Bridge route during peak times.
I consider it a minor victory that Southern realised the folly of reducing the London Bridge trains to 5 Carriage ones whilst also halving the service.
At least we now have the longer trains back.
People are now being actively encouraged to return to the office the rise in passenger numbers on the Overground and subsequent overcrowding between the hours of 7.30am-9.30am and 5pm-7.30pm is clear for all to see.

This post was last modified: 05-04-2023 07:47 PM by nottinghillbilly.

I signed also, but one of the reasons why we didn't get out 4tph back is because since Southern scrapped the old Class 455 units last year, there simply isn't enough rolling stock to operate the full service they used to pre-Covid.

As we have the Overground, we're no longer a high priority for Southern with Penge West and Anerley losing all but three trains a day with none on Sundays.

I would say that since the Elizabeth line opened, Whitechapel is a much easier station to change trains than Canada Water. It's useless if you work at Canary Wharf or London Bridge/Waterloo, but if you're going into the West End or Stratford, it's a much easier commute.

I suspect that Southern is not that interested in trundlers operating in Zones 1-4. These all need to be brought into London Transport and become Overground services and hopefully part of an integrated London transport network, but that won't happen this side of the gen election in 2024.

It would help if some other trains to London Bridge stopped at New Cross Gate. Then passengers could change from the Overground to mainline trains into London Bridge.

agree with both the above points.
I'm probably in the minority that wishes that they would re-instate a service to Charing X 2 an hour at peak times would be the dream!

I'm frustrated about the lack of direct trains to East Croydon and that even before this that service was slower as it became a stopping one. It was great to get down to Gatwick and the South Coast as well as being convenient for walks and cycle rides from the London borders. When I moved here it was a scheduled 14 mins to London Bridge from Sydenham, and 12 from Forest Hill where I subsequently moved to. The brochure when our houses were built in the 30s says nine mins to London Bridge (which I don't believe, as even in more recent times the trains would wait at signalling a mile or so outside LB - priority was always given to the Kent services). The direct line to Charing Cross - 19 mins from Forest Hill was wonderful.

But I sense since the Overground opened demographics changed, this opened us up to working and socialising outside of the City and West End, and it will be seen that overall we are better served.

I still want the service reinstated!

nine mins to London Bridge

Yes, even in the 70s, and probably even through to the mid-late 80s, it was 9 minutes on the fast train to London Bridge and it went on to Charing Cross in another 5 minutes.

People who I'd be showing flats (on Dartmouth Road) to used to ask me if it was near a tube station, and I'd say that they could walk to the station and get off a train at London Bridge in the time it would take to get go from the ticket hall to the platform in some tube stations.

I think there was an advert on the railway bridge saying "Only 10 minutes To London Bridge".

Ah Those were the days!

Talking of railway memories. I missed the trains when they were fast from Forest Hill to New Cross Gate as well as from Sydenham to Norwood Junction.

The Charing Cross through services were useful, but for some reason Southern stopped them calling at Forest Hill and Honor Oak Park except for evenings and all day Sundays.

Another reason why they were axed wasn't just for the untangling of the lines outside London Bridge as part of the modernisation, but it also allowed Southeastern to add another 2 trains per hour into Charing Cross.

The direct trains to Charing Cross ran every half an hour apart from rush hours in working days. The last direct train was 23.12 (maybe slightly later!) from Charing Cross, a bit early, but it was unchanged for twenty years or more as was much of the timetable for a long time, and there was a 2345 from London Bridge. After that it was a train to Lower Sydenham and a long walk. I'd sometimes get the much later train from Victoria and walk from Penge East.

There was no Crystal Palace loop to Victoria certainly in the early 90s and at one point we went from four to three trains an hour to London Bridge, but that was quickly reversed and then when rebranded the South London Metro the Crystal Palace/Victoria loop was reopened, initially with limited service but swiftly to the two hourly service we have today. But it doesn't half trundle and shockingly long train times to Clapham Junction and Victoria. Annoyingly the Crystal Palace to Victoria section to Clapham Junction is not part of the Overground, which is treated as a tube fair, so if you change at Clapham to get onto another train service it is an additional journey on Oyster.

I found the direct train to Caterham, that meshed with the Tatenham Corner, great for a walk or cycle, again now gone, as were the trains to West Croydon (replaced by Overground) but often went to Sutton which was useful, say for kids going to Wilsons.

But hey ho, I am an extensive user of the Overground to Canada Water, and now of course to Whitechapel to use the fast Lizzy Line. Whitechapel as with Bermondsey, takes you near to central London (or say Brick Lane and Shoreditch) without going into Zone 1 (that was part of the deal for the Overground in that it goes into Zone 1 when it shouldn't really but to bring in extra revenue say for those going to Highbury and Islington). For nerds and tightasses (which I may or may not be) you can go the long way round for some journeys via Stratford to avoid Zone 1.

Nothing to do with this thread but when you go to many international airports you get cheap fast transit into the city. But in London we have expensive options, the Heathrow/Gatwick/Stansted Express and the last one isn't an express. Fortunately the Lizzy line will put the first out of business, there are plenty of alternatives for slightly slower trains to Gatwick and if you time it right it is cheaper and quicker to get the coach from Stansted and pick up the tube at Stratford to get home (wont put the lines out of business as many foreign travelers are not aware of cheaper alternatives and some on business wont care)

I commute up to Tottenham Court Road and it's been much better since the Elizabeth line opened. No more changing at Canada Water along with the long travellator at Waterloo to get the Northern line. One change at Whitechapel and a much faster ride to and from Forest Hill.

I haven't gone further than Bond Street, but it's clear that there's a considerably faster journey to Paddington, Ealing Broadway and Heathrow than previously from here.

There haven't been dedicated local lines to East Croydon for years - a local service has to borrow some fast track for the final approach, and there was no problem timetabling this in the past. But now with the increased number of thameslink trains, they have deliberately chosen to choke our service off.
There is a minimal service via Norwood junction, which is subject to delays, but does allow easy interchange outbound. However the policy for the return journey is to strand passengers on a central platform, remembering there are no ramps or lifts here, just an old narrow staircase, obviously ideal for wheelchairs/pushchairs, and luggage from a flight. We are better served by the bus now to get to/from E Croydon, and that is a long journey during the day.
Anyway, it doesn't take much effort to join the dots and realise they don't particularly want our local rail services at london bridge either, clogging up their lines. With trains.

The two trains per hour from Caterham interchange with the Overground on Platform 1 at Norwood Junction. It also works southbound as well with the Overground and Caterham trains stopping on Platform 5.

From Forest Hill: x7 and x37 past to West Croydon connect with the Caterham services, giving same platform interchange.

From East Croydon: the x25 and x55 past to London Bridge from Caterham connect with the Overground services to Highbury and Islington on Platform 1.

This post was last modified: 14-07-2023 09:09 PM by rbmartin.

Thanks for sharing!