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Are our police up tp the job ?
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Posts: 69
Joined: Aug 2009
Post: #1
07-02-2011 09:03 PM

As regards the attack on the man in the job centre look at the facts.

There is CCTV at the job centre and the attackers must have been there for a transaction because they tried to jump the queue before the attack. Their details such as names and addresses must be on the job centres database and its possible that some of the staff there may remember their names.

Despite all that there has been no news at all from the police. Is this going to be another unsolved crime put on crimewatch months after it occurred.

I was mugged in FH about 5 years ago and with the information I gave the police it was an easy job for them to identify the mugger. He was caught on CCTV with a perfect facial shot. After a couple of weeks I called the police for an update and found out they didnt even know there was a CCTV camera in the railway tunnel. Also I noticed the CCTV camera on the other side of the road was pointing at the floor for over a week.

I done 90% of the police work myself and I had to keep EMailing and phoning them because I knew they had done nothing. Eventually another police force (Not Lewisham ) caught him regarding distraction burglaries.

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Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #2
07-02-2011 09:52 PM

I don't think they are, no.

I've been a witness in court now for two things in the last few years, the first a road accident where the victim eventually sadly died ( I had some key evidence about the road conditions that were considered material), the second was a racially motivated assault on public transport. On both occasions I had to do all the running with the police and had to chase for a statement to be taken. In the case of the accident I responded to the signs for witnesses and waited several months before I called back; they had no record of all the messages I had left with them. The case eventually went to a coroners court where I was called as a witness. The police officer giving evidence lied under oath about something pretty important. The other witnesses and I all gasped when he opened his mouth and complete hogwash came out.

The same thing happened on the second case, the assault. I saw the whole thing happen as well as the build up. I called the police but everyone had cleared off when they got there. I gave my contact details to the victim. I chased and chased for several months before the police eventually met with me to identify the attackers who I saw almost daily on the train and who were constantly pushing and shoving other people off the trains in a manner similar to the racial incident. The perpetrators were BTW white midde class commuters, the victim a pregnant young black women on her own. After about 4 months of my harassing the police(!) someone came to take a statement. I was summoned to court 6 months later; the whole thing took about a year. Because we had set up an ambush for the guilty party (the police were on the platform in plain clothes and I had to physically point out the attackers on the platform) I had asked for this not to be revealed in court in case of any repercussions. The police having agreed to this then let the cat out of the bag in court. I wasn't pleased especially as I had to see these people almost every day for several months again( no custodial sentence imposed so they went back to work and I often sat opposite them on the way home). Just as well they had learned their lesson really and didn't have mates sitting waiting to ambush me!

I watched the news tonight and the piece about someone trying to discourage witnesses coming forward because of false police assurances about protection etc. Its not a savoury story but I have to say my opinion also is that I would not trust the police to keep me safe in anything major, so I would think twice before giving evidence again . They would say anything to get you to get a result and then drop you in it like the proverbial stone.
I took the action I did as felt obliged to be the good citizen however unfortunately I am also not inclined to jump in and defend people so readily again as it only caused me a lot of personal grief and hassle.

When the police go on TV and give assurances about public protection they are not factoring in the administrative incompetence that is such a fact of life in the force.

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Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #3
07-02-2011 09:58 PM

Well done Roz . It was good of you to come forward.
Just one thing what does BTW mean ( probably my age but means nothing to me )

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Posts: 69
Joined: Aug 2009
Post: #4
07-02-2011 10:16 PM

I agree with you Roz

Awhile back I decided it was a waste of time giving evidence to the police because they are so lazy. I found you have to do 90% of the work for them and then they may act.

I was mugged in Islington about 11 years ago & I thought they would contact me and treat it as serious but I had to go to the station and chase them up. I gave a description of the guy and they presented pictures for identification which were ludicrous because they didnt fit at all.

When I was mugged in FH I gave a perfect description and reliable witnesses told me the mugger was Irish (White). Lewisham police presented identification photos which included light skinned black men !!

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Posts: 1,538
Joined: Apr 2006
Post: #5
08-02-2011 09:21 AM

I have had a good experience in FH so far with the police. We were burgled some year ago and the police were on scene within 5 minutes of our alarm going off. Late last year I pointed out to a scooter rider that he was riding the wrong way down Manor Mount. He then subjected me to a lot of verbal and threatened to cut me. I called the police straight away and he rode off in a flash. I gave the police his reg number and had a call two days later from a Sgt from Lewisham to say that he had been woken up by the police very early on Saturday morning and had ******* himself. His parents were none to impressed and were selling his scooter.

I have also had a very bad police experience with Islington after the theft of 2 motorcycles on their patch, lack of interest and a joke that I was "just another" bike victim that week. A real lack of professionalism from the police I deal with.

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Posts: 163
Joined: Jul 2003
Post: #6
08-02-2011 09:24 AM

Just one thing what does BTW mean

By The Way Rolleyes

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Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #7
08-02-2011 11:14 AM


Thanks it seems language becoming more difficult to decipher.

I only have had one experience of the local Police , about 8 years ago , when rogue builders trying to defraud my parents. On this occasion they were excellent.

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Posts: 32
Joined: Dec 2010
Post: #8
08-02-2011 06:53 PM

It's all a little bit more complicated than it might first appear though isn't it?

With many crime there are little or no leads - or leads peter out pretty quickly. Even if a suspect is caught on CCTV often images are so grainy then they can be of little or no use: even if a clear image is caught then it all relys on someone recognising them.... images are regularly circulated internally and externally but if no-one recognises them then your options are drying up fast.

Descriptions are all very well - and victims/witnesses may be invited to look at "mug shots". However, the process is goverened by the Law (and of course, the police have to follow it). This has to include putting in "duff" images (even ones that clearly couldn't be the suspecy) and if you describe, say, the suspect as having a big scar down the left side of his face then you have to pixelate out the left hand side of all of the images' faces. (!)

The problem is most people give descriptions that are so vague, not through their own fault, that they are next to useless: unless the description includes clothing - and police are on scene pretty quickly - then it's an uphill struggle.

What about forensics? The things that prints can be lifted off is still pretty limited, criminals also wear gloves, DNA is pretty fragile. It isn't all CSI Miami unfortunately.

Then there is the question of resources. Does anyone have any idea, even roughly, of how many officers are available to take calls at any one time? Or how many cases officers in the burglary/robbery/whatever squad have to deal with at any one time?

The clear-up rate for burglaries and knife-crime hover around the 25% mark in the Met I believe.... which, all things considered, isn't bad.

Another issue is that the police seem to bear the brunt of criticisms levelled at the criminal justice system as a whole - a fair amount of criticism needs to be directed at other areas: The CPS, the courts and so on. The police are doing their job: Lewisham Custody Suite is regularly full to the brim (literally) with robbers, burglars and violent criminals, many of them have a history going back years, they are being put before the courts and so on.....which is what the police exist to do.

The one things I do concede that The Met are terrible at is in communicating with people: on a PR level, in managing expectations and in keeping people up to date and informed.

Despite all that there has been no news at all from the police. Is this going to be another unsolved crime put on crimewatch months after it occurred.

Oh, I didn't realise the police did a daily/weekly update to the general population as to whether people have, or have not, been arrested/charged with specific crimes? Were you expecting a big poster outside the Job Centre with an announcement "another case cracked!"

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robin orton

Posts: 716
Joined: Feb 2009
Post: #9
08-02-2011 10:29 PM

Were you expecting a big poster outside the Job Centre with an announcement "another case cracked!"

asks 'Bensonby.' Why not? As she says herself

The one things I do concede that The Met are terrible at is in communicating with people: on a PR level, in managing expectations and in keeping people up to date and informed


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Posts: 262
Joined: Nov 2007
Post: #10
11-02-2011 03:24 PM

I was concerned on checking that it said there had been 3 violent crimes "in or near" my street in December.

I emailed the safer neighbourhoods team to ask whether this was something unprovoked, potentially repetitive and about which I should be concerned.

I had an email back within the hour setting out the very broad range of offenses that violent crime covers and that whatever the incidents were they should not be of any additional concern to people living in the area. Obviously bearing in mind the need to be careful as normal.

They are very efficient at providing information then.

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