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New primary school for Lewisham?
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sarah176


Posts: 4
Joined: Jan 2011
Post: #61
27-01-2011 09:05 PM

I grew up in Forest Hill. A friend of mine has a child that attends the montessori in question. She encouraged me to have a look at this site, which i did and I was outraged by part of the debate I fell on, hence compelling me to put my point across!

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roz


Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #62
27-01-2011 10:10 PM

This whole thing is becoming interesting.

I initially responded to a thread about a campaign to put a free Montessori school in my local area which I found abhorrent on a number of levels. As a local parent with pre-school children I consider it my right to protest and to ask questions. It seems that there is little wish on the part of the campaigners to debate the issue with local people however having checked with the borough any such proposals will be subject to extensive public consultation on the particular proposals, so they will have to, so that is a relief.

There has been a debate amongst posters on this website which is a good thing however it seems that local parents are to be cyber bullied from afar by friends of the campaigners from other parts of the country and other friends who insist on bullying and harassing posters for the minutae of the words that they choose to use.

It would make me wonder therefore if this is the start of things to come in this campaign.

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fhmum


Posts: 37
Joined: Jul 2010
Post: #63
27-01-2011 10:14 PM

Our January newsletter is now available (attached). Lots of new information available at the website too.

http://www.primroseprimary.com

As I have said in previous posts, I'm not running away from the debate just devoting my time to more productive outlets. We held an open house for all interested parties to attend, where our support grew and we happily answered the awkward questions.

For the record, the campaign has the very best intentions. We are motivated by the shortage of primary school places which, the council itself has told us it cannot alleviate with temporary measures alone. (The campaign and the council are working together not against each other.) We are also keen to increase the diversity of choice available to parents. We would like a Montessori primary school. We acknowledge it's not for everyone and that nobody would be forced to choose it.

Lastly, spare a thought. We are working incredibly hard. I mean 30 hours a week or more on top of a 40 hour working week (or more). Most of us have 2 pre-school children not to mention husbands, wives, partners who are picking up all the extra chores and baby-sitting involved. It's tough but we believe it'll be worth it.

We are putting together the very best campaign we can with no cash other than that we're raising from generous local businesses. I hope our efforts, if nothing more, will be evidence to our children of how much we care and how hard we are willing to try for what we believe to be best for them.

My name is Sarah Cottle. My linkedin profile gives plenty of information as does the presentation on the resources page of the website. The campaign's email is freeschoolcampaign@gmail.com which goes directly to me. There's nothing to hide, only pride in our hard work and hope that we'll garner the support we need.



Attached File(s)
.pdf File  PH Jan Newsletter.pdf (Size: 164.32 KB / Downloads: 422)
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roz


Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #64
27-01-2011 11:18 PM

As I said before, great campaign, but your comment about the campaign working together with the Council is just blatant journalist speak as it isn't true. This Council has currently no policy interest in promoting free schools and like many others is waiting for central government guidance as to how to handle expressions of interest and indeed fund such ventures. To portray this being some sort of joint venture out of mutual interest therefore is just unacceptable.

It is true that the shortage of places cannot be alleviated by temporary measures alone which is why Lewisham Council and other Councils in London has been approaching local schools with longer term masterplanning proposals. But you don't mention that bit of information! These may not include a new school but it doesn't preclude significant remodelling to ensure that our existing schools are up to 21st century educational provision. All of this is however subject to funding which could be derailed due to funds being diverted into these free schools

Sarah, I applaud your committment but there are also others in the community putting in a great deal of time and effort into voluntary initiatives such as playgroups, toddler groups, and school governance to ensure equality of opportunity and to ensure that we do not end up with a divisive two tier system which is being proposed by this Government. I am sure you have the best of intentions but I do think people should stand back and question if this Governments approach is in fact the best way forward.

You are clearly experienced and expert in your field of journalism and doing the marketing stuff but at the end of the day this campaign is presenting factually unsupported arguments to progress its case.

The point about choice is that a free school with a particular educational philosophy such as or even a specific religion will actually reduce choice. That is my view as a parent.Put a different take on this and assume a group of parents campaign to have a C of E School in a local area. As neither my nor my children are religious and I wouldn;t send them there, my children will not be going to this school. The Council has been forced into supporting this school financially and in other ways hence using considerable resources which have been diverted from the modernisation and repair budgets. This school is actually the most local school to us but as my children won't be attending then they won't benefit from it. The next available school is a considerable distance away and is under significant pressure due to parents not wanting their children to attend the C of E school either. The classes are overcrowded and more portakabins are ordered for temporary accommodation. The C of E school on the other hand dwindles as more and more people move away from religion and want a more secular education.
So the mere fact this school exists reduces the choice of people who do not want their children to go to a religious school. Replace C of E with Montessori and you have a similar problem, probably more so, as it is still very much a marginal philosophy with teachers that are not QTS.

I can appreciate the number of reasons why people sign petitions to support something new and innovative which meets a perceived need, but ultimately when it comes down to it, how many parents are going to risk their childs education with Montessori. There is as I see no strong business case for such a school.

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fhmum


Posts: 37
Joined: Jul 2010
Post: #65
27-01-2011 11:41 PM

In short, before I withdraw from talking in favour of doing (or at this point sleeping), I need to say that the council will not fund free schools or be asked to handle their funding and a local council cannot veto a free school application. However, we are working with the council very directly. I'm not sure exactly how else to make the point so I hope this doesn't also qualify as "journalist speak." It's just plain fact.

Secondly, there are many parents who are supporting our plans for a Montessori school. Indeed, many more than we could ever hope to accommodate in a single building. Montessori has in fact informed the development of Early Years Foundation Stage and, in other parts of the world, is widely accepted as mainstream. It is not a danger to our children's education but a holistic, nurturing approach that helps children of all abilities gain confidence and a love of learning.

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roz


Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #66
29-01-2011 12:23 PM

No doubt that could be construed to be correct, ie there are many parents supporting the idea of a free school and have signed the petition, as your campaign, which is very good I have to say, is presenting a lack of alternatives and a lack of action elsewhere.

If I was less well informed I would probably be signing it too, but I am well informed about what's going on on the ground, so I won't. I take it that most of the petitioners know that their teachers won't be properly qualified under the state system and that Montessori principles, whilst being employed in the private nursery system, isn;t actually considered much cop when preparing primary kids for the secondary curriculum.? Where exactly is it considered mainstream? The private school sector? But then you don;t have to be a QTS to work there either. But I suspect that didn't come up.

The short sightedness of your campaign is pretty shocking to be honest but then so is government policy but I guess if people support the Tory philosophy but can't afford private education they will see this is as the way to get a private education for their children at the State's expense . Thats what this is all about really and what the Tories as usual are all about. Top slice funds from a central budget and leave the rest with a lot less.
The other fact is that the current system has proved to be pretty excellent overall and could have been more so, so Gove has little choice other than to come up with a crazy idea to solve a problem that doesn't exist. It is outrageous that in cash strapped times they have instigated a whole new regime and another curricular review all of which will cost millions. The correct approach should be to cease any major changes at this stage that cost substantial amounts of money. Change for changes sake is always expensive.

This government is prioritising new schools (for political reasons primarily) that are outside local authority control so the position of the LA has been compromised and things made more difficult. If a local authority proposed a new school, one that was not approved by previous BSF regime, it is not likely to be approved. Do you feel comfortable with that?

The solution to the lack of places - felt to be a temporary, largely recession fuelled, rather than a straightforward outcome of a rising birth rate - is multi faceted. In some locations, a new school may indeed be the answer. In others,there are many existing schools on existing sites that require remodelling and better use of the existing site, in order to bring them up to date. Many of these sites whilst difficult are low density and with good design can be remodelled to accommodate more pupils without overcrowding. There are many such sites around that are capable of expansion to meet future needs a lot better than a new school would necessarily be if funding were forthcoming.

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shzl400


Posts: 729
Joined: Oct 2007
Post: #67
29-01-2011 06:38 PM

Roz wrote:
the lack of places - felt to be a temporary, largely recession fuelled, rather than a straightforward outcome of a rising birth rate


Is Roz saying that fewer people are paying for private educations? If so, she's mistaken - I understand that all the local private schools report a 20% increase in applications for Year 7 places - as if they weren't about 10x oversubscribed in the first place. Over 600 kids took the Alleyn's exam this year.

This from someone who claims to be "well informed about what's going on on the ground"?

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roz


Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #68
29-01-2011 08:08 PM

http://www.antiacademies.org.uk/Home/free-schools

More useful information here. Their Facebook page enables viewing their AA website plus other news and research articles on the free school concept.

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roz


Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #69
29-01-2011 10:16 PM

Its interesting that 25% of the 195 who signed the petition up until today don't live in Lewisham. A high proportion of that figure don't even live in London and some on the other side of the world. A few even chose to be anonymous.

Are these people outside of Lewisham going to be moving in to take advantage of this new school then?

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fhmum


Posts: 37
Joined: Jul 2010
Post: #70
30-01-2011 10:01 AM

Each signatory has indicated whether or not they have a child or children they would consider sending to Primrose House. We are basing our projections of support for the school on this number rather than the raw number of how many people have signed our petition.

We are grateful to colleagues at Montsesori schools and others around the country, and indeed around the world, who have shown their support for what we are trying to achieve.

Registrations, which will be open soon, will be a more reliable indicator still for likely uptake.

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fhmum


Posts: 37
Joined: Jul 2010
Post: #71
02-02-2011 10:37 AM

I'm delighted to announce that registrations for Primrose House Montessori Primary School are now open. Smile You can register your babies and children of primary school age from today through our website. The registration process is an important element in our planning.

It will help us ascertain where demand is strongest for the type of school we propose. It will also give us the evidence we need to submit our free school proposal to the government.

Registering with us does not guarantee your child a place at the school, nor does it place you under any obligation. It is an expression of interest.

Please don't delay. Complete the online form at http://www.primroseprimary.com/register

Paper versions of the form will be available from Friday. Email: freeschoolcampaign@gmail.com

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Satchers


Posts: 262
Joined: Nov 2007
Post: #72
04-02-2011 02:32 PM

Can someone explain how primary school applications will work where there is a free school as well as a range of community and faith schools?

- Will it still be on the same type of coordinated form for all schools as it is now?
- Will places be allocated by the Council on the same range of criteria as now?
- If not how will this work?

I also want to know if these new schools are intended to serve the local community or not?

P.S. I'm not interested in a place. I very happy children at an existing local primary school I just want to understand how this will change the primary education landscape locally and the choices people actually get to make?

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roz


Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #73
04-02-2011 10:41 PM

Ditto to Satchers questions. The government website isn't clear it seems on how these are going to work but it is something that needs to be clarified sooner rather than later given that the schools admissions date has passed and announcements will be made on April 5th for the September term. I would be interested to see how many parents would turn down a place at a state primary in order to enter Primrose House in September 2011.

I'm also interested in the part of the Primrose House website's blogspot where it suggests rather strongly that Lewisham Council are helping with finding premises for the free school. ie ''We’re investigating sites around Lewisham and the council has offered us support in finding a suitable building.''

I have checked with my local councillors who have looked into this statement and I have been advised that they are not indeed offering that level of support. Generally hard pressed council departments don't have the resources to help free schools get established, particularly as the idea is that such schools are outside the local authority system. So where has this statement come from and why make it in the first place if not to mislead.

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roz


Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #74
08-02-2011 03:40 PM

http://www.localschoolsnetwork.org.uk/20...e-schools/

Some interesting perspectives on free school admissions!

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forest_hill_billie


Posts: 28
Joined: Jan 2008
Post: #75
11-02-2011 02:49 PM

There was a fabulous free school in Kirkdale, Sydenham for many years. A lot of my friends went there as children, and did really well into adult life.

I think diversity is good for any culture and would welcome a free school in the area personally.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirkdale_School

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fhmum


Posts: 37
Joined: Jul 2010
Post: #76
11-02-2011 04:39 PM

Our proposal for a Montessori Primary Free School in Lewisham was submitted about 5 minutes ago.

http://www.primroseprimary.com

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Satchers


Posts: 262
Joined: Nov 2007
Post: #77
12-02-2011 06:00 PM

FH Mum

We are in effect 'lucky' in this part of Lewisham at the moment in that the massive demand for school places means that new schools can be accommodated without necessarily having a detrimental effect on other schools (which may well be what happens where this is not the case and an over provision of places means less pupils and money for some schools).

However, the openness and engagement of these new schools with the areas they serve is critical. As is the admissions criteria. On this matter I think it would be really helpful to understand how you see the admissions working?

I am keen that if there are going to be new schools, as well as expanded existing schools that this is done in an open and consultative way and I would really appreciate a better understanding of how you envisage this working for Primrose Primary. I am concerned that there are a lot of people getting their hopes up about a new school, when in reality they will only stand a chance of getting a place if they live very close to where it ends up being located?

For most schools in the forest Hill area you need to live less than 700m from the school (and in some cases less than 300m) to get a place, and with numbers as they are I don't see this changing.

And if the criteria isn't distance? Then what will it be?

(Sorry if this information is in your Proposal but I haven't had a chance to read it)

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fhmum


Posts: 37
Joined: Jul 2010
Post: #78
12-02-2011 08:34 PM

You raise a good question, Satchers. All Free Schools will be subject to the Schools Admissions Code, like other schools in Lewisham and throughout the UK. As for over-subscription criteria which, after all, is what counts when a school has more applications than places, that remains to be seen.

It is something that we will work through with the Department for Education if our initial proposal is approved. Crucially, we haven't found a site yet and that is a big hurdle to cross. We are looking at some potential locations in SE23, SE26, SE6, SE4 and SE13. I'm not going to name them because of the commercial sensitivity of any negotiations. Besides, we can't enter into any real conversations with private owners about buying or leasing until we know the funding will be available.

Lastly, I would agree with you that there are a lot of people getting their hopes up. This is evidenced by the rising pre-registrations that are coming mainly from what Lewisham council calls PPPL1, roughly Forest Hill and Sydenham, but also from much more broadly in the borough. That demand is coming from this locale isn't surprising. This is where the birth rate has risen 35 percent in a decade and where the shortage of primary places is most acute.

So, I have told the DfE that, given the very strong demand that we are experiencing, our group would consider working with like-minded parents in other areas - in the borough or beyond - to help with proposing other Montessori primary Free Schools. This is, naturally, contingent on Primrose House proving to be a successful school.

I hope that we can bring the option of choosing a Montessori education to many more families. In the meantime, if you would like to discuss further, you can PM me, check out our website http://www.primroseprimary.com or our facebook page (search "Lewisham Montessori"). Feel free to get in touch if I can help further.

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robin orton


Posts: 716
Joined: Feb 2009
Post: #79
12-02-2011 09:14 PM

I've always thought 'free school' is a bit of a misnomer if it's not free to set its own admission criteria.

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roz


Posts: 1,796
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #80
12-02-2011 09:51 PM

I think Sarah it is not enough to simply answer the question by referring to the Schools Admission Code. In my view the situation is that the governing body of the free school could set their own admissions code and criteria as long as it broadly applies with the Code and other central government guidance. It would be good if you could truly clarify the situation so that people can fully assess the range of impacts on themselves and on their community.
If you are indeed intent on setting up a school before Sept this year then surely this is something which has been considered?

http://www.localschoolsnetwork.org.uk/20...-am-truly-
concerned-about-the-fair-admissions-policy-for-free-schools/

The above link to the Local Schools Network website includes a copy of the admissions policy proposed for Toby Young's West London Free School as well as a debate on the subject- and lots of concerns about the impact. Its a different school to this, and its secondary, but it is one of the first in the UK to be published so it could be seen as setting the scene for free school applications.
In the later comments there is also reference to the Government proposing a wholesale rewrite of the admissions code to be ready for July 2011. Not sure how this will work for schools opening in Sept 2011.

I have read the WLFS policy and it seems to basically state that any 'policy' will deal with places that are not filled. It is not entirely clear how places will be allocated initially but I read it as being suitably vague with a potential for first come first served however that is not necessarily the case as it is not explicitly stated. Any remaining places will be filled on a proximity basis after looked after children have been allocated places, much the same priority as there is now. However to me I conclude that initial applications are not restricted in the same way geographically that they are currently, and as pointed out by Satchers in her above post, so in theory, the pupils could come from absolutely anywhere. This supports my view that this school would not necessarily help with the reception place shortage in Lewisham as there is no requirement for them to prioritise Lewisham children. Breaking it down further, it is also unlikely that the school would serve a strict catchment area in the way it does now.

However we need to wait and see but clarity on the admissions policy would need to be clear and consulted upon in due course.

As I see it, and from what I can conclude from the lawyer- drafted WLFS policy this school would operate as private schools do and take any children that apply, probably cherry picking who it wants and leaving the rest.

I would urge anyone interested in admissions to follow the various discussions on Local School Network website which contains a range of views. However the main concern seems to be people not getting the full story!

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