In any case, this timetable revision appears to be coming in December - a long way off from here.
Not good. One thing which would definitely help on the evening trains is having the whole train arrive at the same time - the 18.05 (for example) is made up of two distinct trains. Since both have to be in the station and coupled before the train & platform is advertised on the departure boards, the time between the train platform being announced and the train departing is generally very short, and there's a scrum to get on. Not good.
I often get the 1805 from London Bridge. I hate it as well, because they tend to announce the platform at 1804 (accually that is early for the 1805.)
However, I noticed, that if you go to Southern's web site and look for live departure boards, it will tell you the platforms for all departing trains for the next hour. The 1805 tends to be the 10, 11, or 8. But if you check the web site before you leave work, you can go straight on to the right platform, without having to wait for the annoucement.
That is unless the 1805 is delayed (as it often is) and it is just easier to take the 1818 (platform 13). I am getting dangerously close to trainspotting now, aren't I. Ugh.
18.36 from LB reduced to four carriages today - no particular reason other than to stop people like me getting on until the 18.51. Maybe Southern are involved in some huge psychological experiment to develop the next phase in mass torture, though I doubt they have a train system in Guantanamo Bay. The lucky swines!
Received this today also. A bit more info than the other one, and at least they've used my surname... I don't know if it's heartening or not. It does seem that 'consultation' has taken four years so far.
Dear Mr Lloyd
Thank you for your email.
Please be assured your comments on crowded trains, particularly at peak
times, are not lost on me.
I can understand your frustration. We would ideally like to be able to
provide a seat for all our passengers. However, as you have
experienced, many services have people standing on them every day. Whilst we are
running more services now than ever before and have all available
carriages in operation during peak times, the increase in demand over recent
years has grown such that it has exceeded these improvements. We
regularly monitor the number of people on each train and we do make changes
to the service where we can, although we are limited to the amount of
stock we currently have.
Having said that, there is currently a South London Route Utilisation
Strategy being considered by the Department for Transport which aims to
address the problem of crowded trains and to review the whole of the
South London Metro timetable.
These proposals were formulated by the former Strategic Rail Authority
(SRA) in connection with a review they undertook of the whole of the
Southern network in the early part of 2004. The document published by
their successors, the Department for Transport (DfT), aims to address the
huge increase in the number of people travelling on Southern routes and
to provide a new timetable that is suitable for today’s commuters,
rather than the current timetable which has essentially evolved over
years to be the best it can be without starting again.
I am currently unable to go into detail regarding the South London
Metro lines. However, I would refer you to the South London Route
Utilisation Strategy. The consultation did close on 26 October and we expect its
findings to be made known any time now.
I have written my response. I think it makes sense:
If you can understand my frustration, then I presume you have an answer as to why, for example, the 18.36 was reduced from its usual 8 to 4 carriages this evening? Or why the same happened to the 18.18 a couple of weeks ago? Or why many of the trains between 7am and 9.30am from Honor Oak Park are consistently dropped in carriage size, making everyone's journeys unbearable?
This system is an absolute sham.
It's easy for you to say it's difficult for all travellers to find a seat at some point, but it doesn't have to be this way does it? If one day you have an 18.36 with 8 carriages, then it should be like that every day, shouldn't it? That's simple to understand, but it doesn't seem to mean anything to Southern. Maybe you're experimenting with your radical 'weighting system'? Well don't experiment on us. Just make all peak carriages at least 8 carriages and we might just start getting somewhere.
As for cancellations with no human apologies, 'track adherence' issues (leaves on the line - can no-one rid us of these unexpected leaf-falls?) and defective rolling stock (the driver's having a sandwich), I, and the rest of your 'clients', have had enough.
We ARE sardines, and we are caught in Southern's uncomfortable, overcrowded nets.
A question to your bosses: What is going to be done about it?
Jon Lloyd
Don't you think its time we put some pressure on the regulators as Southern have no intention it seems to improving the service? When is their franchise due for renewal, and how are they faring on their official performance indicators at the minute? However passengers left on the platform rarely feature in performance assessments.
It is actually questionable whether they are in a position to do so. They clearly do not have the rolling stock, perhaps its being used on other more lucrative lines.? The service has never been brilliant but Cotterells letter does not address why this has become so acutely worse in recent weeks.
Anyone feel like having a public meeting to discuss this problem?
I'm lucky enough to be in a jon where I am able to do so, but I took the decision many years ago to bring forward my hours. I.e. get in and leave early. Until very recently I would take the 07:00 to LB, 8 carriages and always get a seat. Coming back again I always get a seat, but it seems strange that the 16:15 to Guildford only has 4 carriages, and is normally very busy, whereas the 16:24 to Victoria is 6 and I often get a 4 seater to myself.
See attachment for the performance figures for December (not meeting targets)
Did you see this:
Quote:
Meet the Southern management team
Our next regular ?Meet the Manager? session is at London Bridge on Thursday 28 February between 0730 and 0930. The following session will be at London Victoria on 27 March between 0800 and 1000.
That's got to be a good opportunity for a mass protest or at least a few fancy dress sardines on the way to the office!?
See attachment for the performance figures for December (not meeting targets)
Did you see this:
Quote:
Meet the Southern management team
Our next regular ?Meet the Manager? session is at London Bridge on Thursday 28 February between 0730 and 0930. The following session will be at London Victoria on 27 March between 0800 and 1000.
That's got to be a good opportunity for a mass protest or at least a few fancy dress sardines on the way to the office!?
I hope none of them were planning on getting there using Southern!!
Isn't it a fortuanate coincidence that this 'meet the manager' should fall into the same time slot everyones meant to be starting work and not on a weekend afternoon.
It's good to see it in the SLP but I do think the closure of the ELL is only a part of the bigger picture which is all about increased commuter numbers and incompetence. We don't want them to blame everything on the closure because then nothing will change.
I've had two very similar responses from Southern - all in one long and rambling paragraph - to others who have posted here. I don't think we will be listened to unless we all get together and create a structured campaign that gets Southern named and shamed in the media more widely. They only start to listen if they are consistently being portrayed in a negative light publicly.
I'm happy to meet up with people who are interested in giving this a go. I've got an example from a train users group in a village near Cambridge who successfully campaigned 18 months ago. It won't happen overnight but it's got to be better than doing nothing.
Get planning then people!
- Get a group together - say 10 people
- Buy the sardines
- Forum photoshop artiste make some labels for the tins
- Alert SLP & Standard
- Present tins to managers
It is the case that the performance on this line has not been as good in recent weeks as it was earlier last year. I can appreciate the frustration highlighted by you and others in the Forest Hill area and must apologise for the problems faced by passengers.
The examples you provide from the forum board have been the result of a variety of factors. For example, the short formation of the 0802 from Honor Oak Park to London Bridge on 29 January was a reaction to the events of 28 January which you mention that stemmed from ice on the conductor rail at various locations across the network leading to widespread disruption. Unfortunately, this continued throughout the evening and into the next morning as rolling stock remained out of place in some cases which in this example caused the 0802 departure to be four carriages instead of eight. The example of the cancelled 0853 from Forest Hill on 24 January was caused by a fault on the train (the driver?s surveillance allowing safe opening and closing of the doors for passengers was faulty) which meant it had to be taken out of service first thing in the morning.
These examples and the others noted are not the kind of service that we want to provide to our passengers and we are pleased to say that performance has improved in the last week with reliability (the number of trains running against the number planned) high and the percentage of trains arriving on time currently standing at 95 per cent for the South London area this month to date.
Let me assure you that there is a strong focus on improving the recent trend in performance and reliability both from our perspective and that of Network Rail such that we get back to previous levels of performance ? for example in summer last year when performance was at a record high.
It is also the case that the Forest Hill line to London Bridge is a particularly busy line, even by London standards, and has seen significant increases in patronage in recent years. In 2006, we increased the capacity available into London Bridge in the morning peaks by adding carriages to trains making them the maximum of eight-carriages, providing 14 per cent more capacity. At the same time there was a 20 per cent increase in demand.
In the short-term there isn?t a clear solution to the rapid increase in demand with all rolling stock and paths to London Bridge in use. In the medium term, Network Rail?s South London Route Utilisation Strategy is looking at just this issue ? how to increase capacity on these lines in South London where it is most required. We expect that the results of this strategy will inform the specification for the new franchise which will be tendered over this year and will start in September 2009.
Until then, the emphasis will indeed be on improving the performance of the current service pattern such that trains run on time and they are made up of the expected number of carriages.
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