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Parking on Gabriel St, Grierson Rd, Lessing St etc
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SandG


Posts: 6
Joined: Feb 2008
Post: #1
21-09-2010 09:36 PM

Has anyone noticed how hard it is to park in the roads mentioned above following the opening of the new line.

We have a young boy and another due very soon. It's impossible to park near our house or even find a space at the moment.

I have written to the local councillor as it doesn't seem right that people are parking all day to use the tubeline to the detriment of the people who live in the area.

Has anyone else noticed this?

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Tersie


Posts: 272
Joined: Feb 2007
Post: #2
22-09-2010 08:20 AM

Yes I have noticed this too - I live on Gabriel Street. I also find it busy at night too, esp weekends. Would not surprise me if CPZ ends up being put in place.

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #3
22-09-2010 10:39 AM

All they need to do is make it illegal to park for 1 hours from 9 to 5 , that will keep all commuters away and also avoid CPZ. Council would only need warden for a short time rather than all day.

There problem solved.

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Tersie


Posts: 272
Joined: Feb 2007
Post: #4
22-09-2010 10:42 AM

Good point Brian or even for 1 hour between 9-10am and 3-4pm - have seen this in some places. If they think they can get revenue out of us though no doubt a CPZ will be put forward.

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #5
22-09-2010 11:16 AM

Yes I agree . When living in Dacres Road I asked the Council to do the same at the Perry Vale end as before 7am empty of cars , by 8.30am blocked right up to half way down Bampton. Probably now doen to Inglemere Rd.
The answer I got that council would only consider CPZs , not my suggested alternative. I guess as you say down to revenue.

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michael


Posts: 3,196
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #6
22-09-2010 12:09 PM

Brian Wrote:
All they need to do is make it illegal to park for 1 hours from 9 to 5 , that will keep all commuters away and also avoid CPZ. Council would only need warden for a short time rather than all day.


This would mean that residents would need to move their cars for an hour every day or park in a completely different road. Hardly solves the problem!

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Tersie


Posts: 272
Joined: Feb 2007
Post: #7
22-09-2010 12:10 PM

Would obviously mean having a residents permit....guess it would be a part time CPZ

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michael


Posts: 3,196
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #8
22-09-2010 12:19 PM

It's a CPZ. You buy a permit from the council and you get to park in your own road.
But I thought Brian wants to do this without a CPZ. So no parking for anybody for a full hour.

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mrcee


Posts: 128
Joined: May 2010
Post: #9
22-09-2010 06:12 PM

I don't see how the one hour can work without a permit either?

I guess a one hour cpz would protect the local businesses though

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #10
22-09-2010 06:22 PM

I accept if you want to retain local parking including the hour in question then probably have to have CPZ.

Seems like it might be getting that only alternative is CPZ and ban on non local cars for 1 hour.

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NewForester


Posts: 377
Joined: Feb 2008
Post: #11
25-09-2010 12:29 PM

The problem with any parking restriction is that it affects local residents who have to park somewhere. Therefore, if you implement parking restrictions over an area, you have to implement a CPZ - which must be self financing. The cost of the permit is affected by the costs of running the scheme, offset by any revenue from Pay and Display parking and fines; the shorter the Pay and Display period, the higher the cost of the Resident's permit.

The residents in the CPZ around Herne Hill finally persuaded Southwark Council to make the zone operational from noon-2pm, Mon-Fri, but at the cost of increased permit fees.

Lewisham.gov.uk Wrote:
Residents' permits

Residents living within one of the borough's Controlled Parking Zones (CPZ) can buy a resident parking permit, if their vehicle is registered at their address within the CPZ.

You can apply for a residents' permit for the parking zone where you live. The permit entitles you to park in any residents' bay in your parking zone.

Residents' permits cost 60 a year or 24 for three months.

Residents with more than one vehicle registered to their address can put up to two vehicles on their permit at no extra charge. However, only one vehicle can use the permit at a time.

The charges explained

The Secretary of State requires that we charge for permits (the zone must be self-financing) but Lewisham keeps the permit cost as low as possible.

At present there is no upper limit on how many permits a resident can purchase, providing they meet the criteria set out above.

People occasionally comment that they have paid their road tax, and ask why they should have to pay again to park outside their own house. In fact we each have an equal right to use the road; it is a public highway. When you buy a permit, you are paying to exclude other users during the CPZ operating times, usually commuters.


However, do CPZs actually solve the problem, or simply shift the commuters to someone else's street?

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borderpaul


Posts: 87
Joined: Oct 2007
Post: #12
26-09-2010 05:24 PM

The answer to the last question in my opinion is it depends.

If Lewisham implement a parking zone that includes all streets within 10 minutes walk of the station then a lot of commuters will alter their habits or perhaps park in the big car park beside the station.

If a CPZ is implemented in one area that provides parking for commuters within 10 minutes of the station then they will move on to the next streets that are within 10 minutes of the station until one by one they are forced out of each area and then they will park at the car park, another station or take the bus etc. You change behaviour by a sanction.

As the council says the parking permit charge is an exclusion charge, you pay to exclude others such as our friendly commuters who are just here for the free park.

Like most people though I favour the 1 hour restriction that excludes the commuters but allows people to drop off their kids at schools or visit the shops.

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shzl400


Posts: 729
Joined: Oct 2007
Post: #13
26-09-2010 06:35 PM

Er... what big car park by the station - we're talking Honor Oak, not Forest Hill here!

For us, CPZ would be a disaster as we have two vehicles (family car and van for OH's business), which are both often at home.

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borderpaul


Posts: 87
Joined: Oct 2007
Post: #14
26-09-2010 09:40 PM

Er.... we're talking SE23 here, Forest Hill and Honor Oak. The big car park is there to serve all.

One person's disaster is another person's opportunity. You see a CPZ and paying 120 a year as a disaster while SandG sees paying 60 as a reasonable price to pay to park near her house with her kid.

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NewForester


Posts: 377
Joined: Feb 2008
Post: #15
27-09-2010 09:50 AM

@shzl400 - two cars is not necessarily a problem as

Quote:
At present there is no upper limit on how many permits a resident can purchase, providing they meet the criteria set out above. [ie vehicle is registered at their address within the CPZ.]


However, it should be noted that 'Car Free Developments' (such as Forest Hill Central) have no rights to any permits; their drivers will be forced to use the same facilities as commuter traffic.

I was recently told that the reason that charges were introduced for the Perry Vale car park was that locals complained they could never park there... It appears that you cannot please all the people. Personally, I would like to keep a few spaces free for short term parking so that people can pick up their mail from the sorting office and then set the charges at a level which garnered revenue for Lewisham and got the commuters into the car park.

I'm guessing that some commuters who used to go to Forest Hill now go to Honor Oak Park as they can get on the trains.

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brian


Posts: 2,002
Joined: Apr 2005
Post: #16
27-09-2010 10:45 AM

Surely correct that people that buy into Car Free Devolpments should not have permits.

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ryananglem


Posts: 167
Joined: Apr 2009
Post: #17
27-09-2010 11:28 AM

Surely that oversimplifies the needs of some people. You may well buy into a Car Free Development not needing a car and not thinking you will ever need one, but your circumstances may change and you may need one for work (or some other reason) - would this mean that you would be forced to move?

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rshdunlop


Posts: 1,111
Joined: Jun 2008
Post: #18
27-09-2010 11:41 AM

When the Perry Vale car park was free, it was completely full of commuter cars by about 8.30am. As none of these people returned to collect their cars until evening, there was never a free space for local users.

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NewForester


Posts: 377
Joined: Feb 2008
Post: #19
27-09-2010 12:02 PM

but all that has happened is that commuters have moved to free on street parking. Are you saying that you do not want any commuters who drive to use our stations?

If we accept that some people will drive (sometimes not very far), where should they park? How can we encourage them to get to the station by foot/public transport? Should LOROL run commuter buses from eg.Tewkesbury Lodge to the station?

Surely the solution is not just to manage parking.

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rshdunlop


Posts: 1,111
Joined: Jun 2008
Post: #20
27-09-2010 12:16 PM

I didn't make any judgements, I just agreed that there was nowhere for locals to park when it was free. Commuters can still use it, if they are prepared to pay 3 a day. Either the commuters go elsewhere, or the locals go elsewhere. It's all about displacement. Unless people start walking or taking the bus instead. But I suppose if you aren't prepared to pay 3 a day to park, you probably won't want to pay for two bus journeys a day either.

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