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I would have thought that St Davids is just such a place. The entrance is challenging for buggy and baby carrier users (as it must be for those in a wheelchair too I imagine). Still, if you don't think that works then why not open one?

There is also Mr Lawrence, in Crofton Park, which is a positively child un-friendly wine bar (am talking about during the day BTW). Mind you, he can afford to be picky. I don't reckon many new businesses could do that, locally, as it would be flying in the face of the local market demographic. YMMV.

What amuses me about the article in The Standards the photo odlf the owner standing outside with w clear view ofba baby buggy inside.

I applaud the owner though, parents with kids, control your little darlings or s*d off.

I'm up for more suggestions on this one - hopefully without things turning into a 'parents vs the childless' clusterbumble!
I adore kids (most of the time!) myself, but am at the same time an adult who has made a conscious decision not to have any.
This, combined with a sensitivity to loud noise and haphazard chaotic environments, seems to mean I'm a bit limited for where to go for daytime/early evening drinks/meals in this area without feeling a bit frazzled.
Ones I can think of and like, offhand:

The Catford Constitutional
The Dartmouth Arms
The Honor Oak (I don't have a prob with the acoustics towards the back/righthand side, or in the restaurant)
Mr Lawrence and the Beer Dispensary

I think it's great that a lot of places nowadays are more child-friendly, but it would be pleasant to be able to go to a nice grown-up, chilled, old-fashioned sort of place too (thinking of the discreet chintzy places in books by writers like George Gissing and Patrick Hamilton.......without all the misery tho! )

Try also the Montage on Dartmouth Road - just not downstairs where there is a cool play area. Am hearing great reports about Norris and Knight on Forest Hill Road but haven't had the chance to try that yet (with our wonderfully behaved saucepans LOL).

What places in Forest Hill ARE full of these so called little monsters who should 's** off'?

There are loads of places to eat and drink around here, I've yet to find any which are as described by him!

Totally agree but it is all about perception. I think that this part of London is generally very child tolerant - a good thing in my view - and other parts frankly are not.

One can sometimes encounter bad parenting, which gives other children a bad rap, but then I say calmly challenge the parents in that case and don't just fume about it on a forum. Bear in mind that they are probably at their wits end too.

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This post was last modified: 21-11-2015 12:44 PM by crassbelch.

Yes and some of life's choices are where you live and how to get along with the people who you meet. Even with the myriad of adult spaces you could frequent locally, you seem to choose those with children. Methinks you also choose to complain rather than just take an easy path. :-)

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See replies in this thread and others that you have started too. Why not try some of the suggestions and report back? Over and out.

So what places in Forest Hill are ruined by "prissy local mothers and their screaming babies and unruly toddlers" because I've yet to see one, unless you are in the Horniman in Half term, I've yet to experience what you describe.

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This post was last modified: 23-11-2015 05:34 PM by crassbelch.

I know of one very local place you could go that you'd love. It's got nice decoration, good music, it's very convenient. Prices are LOW. Yep. Enjoy your evening alone at home in quiet solitude. Bliss! (Both for you and the local families boosting the local economy )

Today's Daiky Mail page 15

It's funny when people say they would like to have a child free cafe and people get annoyed. The annoyed may not even have children but want to get annoyed on someone's behalf. I like children, I like them so much I have two. The thing is we brought them up well behaved so they are able to sit quietly and entertain themselves, when they were younger we made sure we were able to entertain them enough so they kept quiet to go out.

Please dont slag off people who would like a quite cafe to sit and have a quiet coffee. If your child cannot sit still, enjoys running around throwing cake then I ask you nicely, look after them. Yes I to have had the thousand yard stare from lack of sleep and wondering what the Lewisham adoption line number is but also realise that as much as my little dears can drive me to distraction at time, they are MY children and I am responsible for their actions. Not the poor lady hunkered over her Mac in the corner not wanting to talk to little Johnny as she has a deadline. Or the guy in the corner who is sneaking in a quick coffee and a catch up on the news on his tablet looking in horror as little Tinkerlilly smears Nutella over his jeans.

So, before you hammer your keyboard to dead in righteous indignation about the Daily Mail link, give a thought to those of us who just want a quiet coffee in a coffee shop with quite well managed children.

However!!

Child free restaurants! NO WAY, do you know how much babysitters are

This post was last modified: 24-11-2015 10:49 AM by Londondrz.

Kids are kids. We were all there once. Sometimes they behave well sometimes they don't. It's up to the cafe to decide if they want to serve them or not. Making people feel.uncomfortable taking their family to a car or restaurant is pathetic in my view. Of course no none wants bad behaviour but that isn't limited to kids! Far from it. I've seen adults behave much worse. Ban adults too?

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This post was last modified: 24-11-2015 08:41 PM by crassbelch.

If there is enough demand for a child-free cafe one will turn up sooner or later. I'd say it's unlikely in SE23 as it would alienate too much of the population but who knows - would be a hell of a risk for someone which is why I don't see it happening. It might occur through more subtle methods, i.e not having high chairs, room for Prams etc, no child menu for food. Ultimately during school term you are only going to have under 5s, some of who will be very young and whose noise volume can't always be controlled.

I am of mixed British and European vintage, and in mainland Europe attitudes can be quite different. In Spain for example, kids are much more allowed to be, well kids. The noise is much louder generally to you don't notice as much...

The best solution may be listening to some music with your coffee with some noise cancelling headphones. I head the sound of fox calls are very soothing

I have a son. He's 4. He's well behaved most to the time. I too wouldn't want to be in a cafe or restaurant with unruly kids. Partly because I wouldn't want my son to copy them.

I can't say I've been anywhere yet that has unruly kids in it. Perhaps I'm just lucky.

Banning kids, No, that's not at the answer and quite a backward way of thinking. Asking for people to keep their children well behaved, by all means. Even parents want some piece and quiet and enjoy themselves when they spend their hard earned cash while eating out.

What I find rather depressing is when someone sees a young kid and expects them to be a 'brat'. This is 2015, not 1815.