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Evict Foreign Nationals from Lewisham Council Homes, Demands MP Candidate
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George Whale


Posts: 13
Joined: Apr 2015
Post: #1
24-04-2015 10:11 AM

Thousands of Lewisham Council Homes Are Being Let to Foreign Nationals: Move Them out and Move Locals in, Demands Candidate

A candidate in next month's general election has asked Housing Minister Brandon Lewis to consider a change in the law to enable local authorities to remove foreign nationals from social housing in order to free up homes for hard-pressed British families.

Quoting figures obtained by Migration Watch UK (1), Dr George Whale claims that up to 40 percent of Lewisham social housing is occupied by non-British nationals, and that the influx of immigrants into the capital since these statistics were published likely makes that percentage even greater.

Dr Whale, who represents the Liberty GB party in the Lewisham West and Penge constituency, is demanding that Lewisham Council "come clean" about the number of foreign nationals occupying public homes in the borough, and wants an overhaul in the Council's selection policy to give clear preference to people who have been in the area for many years. "This is not only fairer", he says, "but it will enable families rooted in the area to stay here, which will contribute to social continuity and cohesion".

"More than 600 families in the borough are in bed and breakfast accommodation" (2), claims Whale, "and many more are paying crippling private sector rents. Why should hard-working Brits who've been in Lewisham for decades have to endure this kind of modern-day serfdom when others can just breeze in and enjoy the security of subsidised social housing? There's no fairness to it."

Full article here: http://libertygb.org.uk/v1/index.php/new...-candidate

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ForestHillier


Posts: 490
Joined: Jul 2010
Post: #2
24-04-2015 10:21 AM

Well he does appear to have a point - not so sure about evicting people however - maybe a bit harsh

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George Whale


Posts: 13
Joined: Apr 2015
Post: #3
24-04-2015 10:36 AM

Give them 6 months, say, to find private rented accommodation.

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michael


Posts: 3,199
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #4
24-04-2015 10:46 AM

It is clear that the figures are a gross distortion of the real situation. I would urge members of the forum to take a look at analysis of the data at https://fullfact.org/factchecks/migratio...nals-18654 before jumping to the same conclusions as George Whale.

1. Figures refer to new applications for social housing, not to existing tenants, so the claim that "40 percent of Lewisham social housing is occupied by non-British nationals" has no basis whatsoever.
2. The figures used have regarded all individuals with no nationality status as if they must be foreign. It would be most accurate to say that 6% (rather than 40%) of successful new applicants in Lewisham are known to be foreign nationals.
3. It is unclear how much of Lewisham applications are covered by the CORE data, so the figure could be much higher or lower than the 6% (especially considering the 36% of applications with no data).

I hope that George Whale will accept that the claim of "40 percent of Lewisham social housing is occupied by non-British nationals" is not supported by the figures from MigrationWatch, and that the MigrationWatch statistics make it incredibly unlikely that the level is anywhere near 40%.

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rshdunlop


Posts: 1,111
Joined: Jun 2008
Post: #5
24-04-2015 01:27 PM

Dr Whale has been very busy posting fictious statistics on the Sydenham Town Forum and robustly challenged on it. I fear it's my fault he's turned up here, as I mentioned the hustings thread here on one of his posts there. I'm so, so sorry.

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George Whale


Posts: 13
Joined: Apr 2015
Post: #6
24-04-2015 01:32 PM

It's called free speech, Mr Dunlop - I'm happy to have the opportunity to introduce you to the concept.

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George Whale


Posts: 13
Joined: Apr 2015
Post: #7
24-04-2015 01:43 PM

@michael

From the Migration Watch report:

"41. Lewisham has full coverage of its social housing lets in CORE and reports that 9% of its social housing lets went to foreign nationals. However 35% of these lets are marked as having refused to give their nationality. So the proportion confirmed as going to British nationals is 58%."

One might ask, why would British people refuse to give their nationality?

I contacted the chief Executive of Lewisham Council some while ago asking for accurate, up-to-date figures on this, but am still awaiting a reply.

http://www.migrationwatchuk.com/briefing...cument/260

This post was last modified: 24-04-2015 01:43 PM by George Whale.

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rshdunlop


Posts: 1,111
Joined: Jun 2008
Post: #8
24-04-2015 01:43 PM

I'm not denying your right to free speech. No one on either forum has. I'm also free to say I'd rather not read your fictious claims masquerading as facts, and to apologise to like-minded forum members if it's my responsibility that you are here and they are likewise afflicted.

If you think my post had anything to do with free speech, your grasp of logic is shakey to say the least. Unless you struggle to understand English. Is it your second language?

And it's not 'Mr' Dunlop. Why do assume I am male?

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gbrownings


Posts: 94
Joined: Aug 2012
Post: #9
24-04-2015 01:45 PM

Anyone using Migration Watch for their 'facts' has pretty much lost the argument before they start.

Migration Watch has a well-deserved reputation for never letting the truth get in the way of the story....

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/edit...09327.html

"....lies, damned lies and statistics......"

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ForestHillier


Posts: 490
Joined: Jul 2010
Post: #10
24-04-2015 01:47 PM

MPS lying - whatever next ?

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Snazy


Posts: 1,495
Joined: Jan 2008
Post: #11
24-04-2015 01:56 PM

RSH, the assumption and inaccuracy in calling you Mr, was to keep true to other comments maybe? lol Rofl

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michael


Posts: 3,199
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #12
24-04-2015 02:10 PM

Migration Watch don't seem to be clear whether the figure in Lewisham is 6% or 9%. While they state that 'the proportion confirmed as going to British nationals is 58%', it is a huge assumption to make that 35% of applicants refused to state their nationality because they are not British. I've heard plenty of British people who refused to complete ethnicity/nationality questionnaires.

But George Whale still fails to recognise the difference between current occupation of properties and allocation of social housing in a single year. The assumption that all social housing is occupied by the same proportions of nationalities as new allocations in 2011 has no logical basis.

The claim that "up to 40 percent of Lewisham social housing is occupied by non-British nationals" is not supported by the Migration Watch statistics. George Whale should correct this statement.

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George Whale


Posts: 13
Joined: Apr 2015
Post: #13
24-04-2015 02:59 PM

@michael

The fact is that nobody knows what the true figure is, though my estimate of up to 40% seems reasonable, given that it corresponds to the percentage of foreign-born people in inner London.

Here's the reply I received from Lewisham Council:

"Dear Dr Whale

Thank you for your email to the Chief Executive.

Unfortunately, we are unable to provide you with an accurate figure for the percentage of social housing currently occupied by foreign nationals in the Borough. The information that you have requested is not available as the Council does not capture this data.

It may be possible for you to make some rough estimates from census data which records whether people were born overseas.

Kind regards,

****

Chief Executive's Personal office"

This post was last modified: 24-04-2015 03:04 PM by George Whale.

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rshdunlop


Posts: 1,111
Joined: Jun 2008
Post: #14
24-04-2015 03:16 PM

Your assumption is not reasonable. It is baseless.

Was it the University of Westminster that awarded your doctorate? If so, I'm sending mine back.

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michael


Posts: 3,199
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #15
24-04-2015 03:40 PM

I checked the census data for Lewisham.
70% have a UK passport and 10% have no passport. Which would suggest that only 20% of Lewisham's population are not British nationals. Foreign-born is different measurement to Foreign Nationals (33% in Lewisham).

George Whale Wrote:
The fact is that nobody knows what the true figure is

Which is why your claim that "40 percent of Lewisham social housing is occupied by non-British nationals" should be disregarded by everybody looking for facts.

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George Whale


Posts: 13
Joined: Apr 2015
Post: #16
25-04-2015 08:18 AM

@michael

Unfortunately, these figures (which in any case will likely have increased in the last four years due to the continuing large influx of immigrants) bring us no closer to establishing the actual percentage of foreign tenants. A meaningful discussion would only be possible if Lewisham Council kept proper records of nationality. The fact that they don't raises suspicion that they are concealing the extent of the problem.

We can argue about percentages, but whether it's 20, 30 or 40, it is wrong for foreigners to be taking precedence over British people in social housing allocation. Or perhaps you can provide a justification?

This post was last modified: 25-04-2015 08:26 AM by George Whale.

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MessyMessy


Posts: 22
Joined: Feb 2013
Post: #17
25-04-2015 12:11 PM

As an immigrant, I completely support this and look forward to paying a discounted tax rate since me and my kind will no longer qualify for this sort of benefit. What do you think would be fair? Rents are really high, but I'd settle for a monthly tax discount of 800 quid / month.

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scully


Posts: 31
Joined: Sep 2011
Post: #18
26-04-2015 08:24 PM

Mr Whale I do think there is justification and that is that preference is based on housing need rather than nationality. Like it or not we live in a country where we have freedom of movement within the EU and also take in those seeking asylum. Only once their asylum claims are verified would these refugees be entitledsocial housing. These policies are something I feel we should be proud of. There are also restrictions on the rights of EU nationals to claim benefits and access social housing. Therefore not only are the statistics in question in the original posts but also the rationale.

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michael


Posts: 3,199
Joined: Mar 2005
Post: #19
30-04-2015 03:41 PM

Bob from Brockley takes up the issue at http://brockley.blogspot.co.uk/2015/04/h...re-in.html

Quote:
...But the figures are out of date. The [Migration Watch] briefing says that for its "local connection" requirement for getting social housing, Lewisham "just requires the applicant to be resident in the borough". Since then, Lewisham has instituted a two year residence rule, which will have dramatically cut migrants - and certainly new migrants - from the waiting list. Tory reforms have made it harder and harder for migrants to get access to council housing too, further cutting the numbers. (To be eligible, you need "settled status", i.e. permanent residence; to get that you need to have already lived here for three or in most cases five years plus pass a "Life in the UK" test that most of us Brits would fail.


I recommend reading Bob from Brockley in general, but particularly this article.

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Tinkerbell


Posts: 356
Joined: Dec 2007
Post: #20
30-04-2015 07:55 PM

MessyMessy - I agree. Having paid a high tax rate in the UK for the past 22 years, I would quite like to now get a little stamp in the "foreign" of my two passports, which shall, from now on, entitle me to a special 25% "foreign-born and no longer eligible for council housing or housing benefit, should it ever be required" tax discount. Where do I sign up for the scheme?

But of course, Mr. Whale, since I have 2 passports and actually happen to have been born in..umm, Europe's largest economy (you know the one, that supremely arrogant nation where old Nige's wife was born, too...not that she's a foreigner or anything) now you're going to argue that I am the wrong kind of "foreign", aren't you?

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