I suggest you contact the BBC or ITV London Tonight and ask for a camera crew to come to the station one morning to record the sight of paying passengers unable to board the train.

Only 4 carriages on the 7:20 this morning, half the normal length. Nasty squeeze.

I wanted to ask people who travel later in the morning a couple of questions:
Are any of the 6 carriage trains that run between 7:30am and 9am?
What time does the 8:42am train arrive at London Bridge? (According to the timetable it arrives at 9:01am but I see no reason why it should take so long).

I'm sure it's all part of the train co's cunning plan - jam 'em in like sardines, so they can't fall over - oh look, no need for hanging straps! On the other hand, at 5ft not a lot, doesn't do me any good anyway.

This is really wierd. I agree the trains have been very overcrowded lately. However, I came in on the 8:29 this morning, which is normally packed and it was empty. And not many people got in at HOP or Brockley either. Some wierd pocket time I guess.

I think you'll probably get a camera crew there and find that for once everything runs like clockwork. It might be an idea for people to record things on their mobiles or digital cameras and to make a proper diary and set up a web blog. Can anyone start this up? How about the Forest Hill Society?

Michael, did you mean are any of the trains that run 7.30 - 8.45 made up of only 6 carriages? If so then the 0748 is usually just 6 carriages. Most others are 8 as far as I'm aware.

For clarity, thats the 0748 from FH - it doesn't stop at HOP, just New Cross Gate and London Bridge

Thanks ermsey, it is useful to know that there are some six carriage trains (which everybody wants to be extended to 8 carriage trains). There is a 8:42 train on the timetable (see attached) which apparently takes 20 minutes to get to London Bridge. Personally I am not convinced that it really takes 3 minutes more than any other train. Has anybody got that train?

Sardine jam, my favourite.

Despite evidence to the contrary, Southern have a helpful poster to inform customers that they are not sardines. http://www.southernrailway.com/main.php?page_id=454

Thanks for that link, I have sent them feedback asking about 4 and 6 carriage trains, and pointing out that we are, in fact, sardines!

The 6.18pm from LB to Victoria last night was cut from 8-4 carriages for no particular reason. Maybe their 'state of the art' weighting system tells them that's all that is needed, but there was certainly still 8 carriages worth of people on that train last night.

And with the recent reports threaded here about attacks on trains, I'm sure that while 'steaming' would be impossible on such packed trains, the opportunity to pickpocket would rise dramatically.

The 08.35 is 6 carriages - but it runs fast to London Bridge from FH so doesn't get any more crowded after FH. The 08.42 normally arrives at LB at 9am, give or take a minute; I think it takes so long to get there because of time stopped at signals on the approach to LB.

The trains are getting ridiculous. I think they should be designed more like tube trains, with straps from the ceilings. There is nothing to hold on to if you are standing. I manage to squeeze on at HOP (most mornings, but not all). The good people of Brockley don't stand a chance.

The good news is that we will be getting tube trains in a couple of years, complete with straps to hold on to!

I don't even attempt to get the train to/from work anymore. I work in Canary Wharf and used to take the train to London Bridge and then the Jubilee Line (I could never be bothered with changing onto the ELL at New Cross, partly because I am lazy and partly because the Jubilee Line trains were always pretty packed at London Bridge and people often didn't seem able to get on at Canada Water). The journey became so unpleasant (mostly the Jubilee Line part) that I decided to try the bus then DLR option and I've stuck with that ever since. But today I was meeting someone in London Bridge for breakfast so attempted to get the train from HOP. I arrived to find the 7.03 was cancelled due to a fault with the train, and the next train, which wasn't due until 7.23 was down to 4 carriages (not sure if it is usually 6 or 8). On the basis that the 7.23 would end up incredibly overcrowded, I again ended up on the bus to Lewisham and got a train from there. It kind of reinforced my decision to use an alternative route to work, despite it taking longer than the train/tube on a good day. However, it seems to me that even the bus is busier since the New Year, perhaps due to people who used to take the ELL to avoid Zone 1 going by bus instead.

Look,with respect to everyone, you need to complain to the right people as well as vocalising on here. And to do it in a way that grabs attention in a constructive manner. You English - and
I dont mean this rudely- are too polite and avoid confrontation, preferring to whinge , seethe quietly and complain to the wrong people.
You forget that organised protest, not letters to the Times, moved us all forward on most issues. So whats wrong with organising some form of protest - even the police are doing it these days. What gets things going these days is action, the threat of action, and headline grabbing. These people in charge don't give a flying fig about your travel problems as they have the complaints industry to ply you with platitudes and promises.

Suggestions could include a day/week of a series of action/planned disruption- ok its more of what we don't want , and will upset a few commuters, but think of what could happen if on the next time theres total chaos and no one can get on anything, people block the doors and stop them from closing. Nothing will move anywhere. The network will be disrupted completely. A good photo opportunity. A little undeveloped as an idea perhaps but you have to start somewhere. When the police arrive, its a case of, ' sorry officer, I didnt realise my foot was blocking the door'.

Time to kick ass. Lets do it.

I disagree - and I am not English. Vocalising on here is a good thing because it means that we are all a little bit more knowledgable about the overall situation. If I go to the station at 9am (as I did today) and there are delayed/cancelled trains, all I know about is the situation at 9am - and that can be attributed to one faulty train.

However, if I read on here that there was chaos all morning (as has been the case for most of this week) then I have more information to allow me to make decisions about the best time to travel (or whether to travel at all).

One thing which I would like to see is the "Live Departure Boards" facility offered by National Rail (and available through the train companies) made into something you can look at historically. Seems to be the case that the train companies offer as little information as they possibly can.

I can't actually see what good a protest of the sort described would do in this sort of situation - other than further disrupt journeys and give the train company another excuse ("passenger action") - did it make any difference when passengers on SWT complained about the width of seats? Or the rise in their fares?

Southern will, I imagine, just say that there's no point in plastering over things in the short-term when the ELL is coming in (hopefully) 2.5 years.

Attention Commuters! On yer bike!

I started riding mine to Baker Street each day since the beginning of this year. Prior to that, for the last six years, I've been doing the train commute from The Hill to London Bridge and Jube tube to Baker Street.

Reasons that inspired the change:

1. Needed to do some exercise to build my health, lose some weight and boost my happiness.
2. Wanted to do more for the Earth.
3. Felt depressed squeezing onto a train then tube.
4. And a monthly bonus...I get to keep over 100 quid. Sorry Southern Railways, it's all mine now! *Tosses back his head and cackles*

This is how we English do things. We don't confront and annoy. We find intelligent, workable alternatives. And then we have a nice cup of tea.

I agree. This is the best place to get an overview of a situation such as this. And what is wrong with venting a little frustration?!

And the bad news is that they won't be going into central London and will only be four carriages long!

e_r, it could be that Roz was inciting debate rather than commuter chaos.

I come to this conclusion because on this thread, DECENT DEBATE WANTED, Roz suggested that, "There are various ways of instigating debate; one is to say something completely controversial and act as devils advocate, a little bit naughty...?

Although, if my conclusion is wrong, then I'm sure that Roz will happily step forward as the police are making arrests in the train doorways at Forest Hill Station and courageously confess to being the revolutionary mastermind in this cauldron of frustration.