So reading the update on Southern's site, those evening services withdrawn for a week, and then for four weeks, are now gone for good.

I can't say I'm surprised. I guess that's their cunning "alternative plan" to solve things.

Given the fragility of our local train service, I have been exploring ways to get back from town if things go wrong. I had a meeting in Victoria yesterday and went up on the direct Victoria train, which ran late and took something like 40 minutes with an unexplained stop outside Balham. On the way back, I tried the 13:55 to Penge East, as I was curious to see how long it would take. This service reached Penge East at 14:09 which is a minute or two early as it happens. The walk to the 176/197 bus stop is about 7 minutes and I was back in Forest Hill by 14:32 - so actually quicker that the Victoria-London Bridge service despite a walk and a bus journey!

Getting to LB last night there was a good 25 min wait for the next FH train so I got the first one to go to New Cross Gate, changed and got the Overground. A heck of a lot easier than schlepping all the way to Canada Water on the Jubilee Line.

davidwhiting,

You could try a train from Victoria to Catford, getting off at Crofton Park. Then the 122 to Forest Hill.

I am interested in various routes into and back from London as well.

How many trains are running to from London Bridge to New Cross Gate and then fast after that?

Not sure if this Thameslink consultation is worth responding too. It's mainly for the Brighton to Bedford/Cambridge services from Dec 2015 and then from 2018. But there is a Southern section (Southern joins Thameslink as one company in July 2015 to become 'GTR'), and on p.17 a 'South London Metro' section.

Two things:

- it says 'on all routes (Southern metro) the main frequencies are to remain unchanged...' - unchanged from when though? From when they've slashed the West Croydon services on Jan 9th? From Dec 14 when they launched this consultation and the 08.31 from FH still existed? Being 'unchanged' from the current service really isn't good enough.

- specifically it only asks about the LB to Tattenham Corner services - it suggests these continue as present too. But perhaps enough pressure would mean they could accommodate some peak time stops for Brockley, HOP, FH etc. to compensate for the loss of other services?

You can respond to gtr.timetableconsultation@gtrailway.com before 30 Jan.

This post was last modified: 23-01-2015 02:58 PM by mrwandle.

Outside peak times, jumping on the 185 is sometimes easiest route to/from Victoria. From the Horniman to/from Victoria is 40-45 minutes outside peak - and late at night can be closer to 30. No changes and you always get a seat since it's the first stop.

And if you're outside school run time, then Brixton and the P4 isn't a bad option.

I am increasingly tempted to use the 171 bus to go into town. (As said no changes and a seat.)

The trains home from Charing Cross to Catford Bridge seem OK at night and now don't stop at London Bridge. (Fast from Waterloo to Ladywell!) Then I get a bus home.

Looking at the evening peak between 5-6pm.

1709 to Sutton
1724 to Victoria (all stops)
1739 to Sutton
1754 to Victoria (all stops)

So there's 4tph to New Cross Gate with two being fast between NXG and Norwood Junction.

I was at West Croydon station today. The 12.09 to Dalston Junction was cancelled. However, an Overground train came in about 12.09 and I got on it to Forest Hill!

Southern were meant to have a 'Meet the Manager' session tomorrow morning, but they have postponed this until next Thursday.

So let's hope that next week we find out a lot more about Southern's plans to reinstate the missing services on our line, and provide a more punctual service than we have had in January. If they are not able to fully reinstate the services then we need to have additional trains on the Overground system - either from the New Cross route or using spare Southern rolling stock.

It just gives them more time to draft in extra security !! It amazes me that its taken this long for the Managers to meet their customers, the anger and frustration just builds. It will be an interesting session for all those involved, I'm sure.

There was a Westminster Hall debate yesterday on London Bridge services, including a contribution from Jim Dowd.

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/whall/?id=...-27a.214.0

Relevant excerpt

Jim Dowd (Lewisham West and Penge, Labour)
This is the point that I wanted to make. The Minister will be aware that Southern has cancelled all the peak-hour evening services from London Bridge to West Croydon and is encouraging people to use Overground instead. Actually, it is encouraging them to go on to Norwood Junction and then go back to the station that they originally wanted to get to. That is now causing severe overcrowding on the Overground service, so will she look into it?

Claire Perry (Parliamentary Under-Secretary (Department for Transport); Devizes, Conservative)
The hon. Gentleman is aware that that is a temporary reduction in the service, designed to let the new timetable, which is more disruptive for Southern operations rather than Southeastern, bed in. The hope is that those services will be restored as soon as possible. I am very aware of the concerns.

Let me put it on the record that all of us realise that many people at London Bridge station are working very hard on a daily basis to deal with the disruption. These are people on the front line—operational staff. We would all like to pass on our thanks to everyone out there who is trying to maximise convenience for passengers.

This post was last modified: 28-01-2015 01:37 PM by simonk.

The trouble with that statement from Southern in Michael's post is that they're talking about how they're going to improve "reliability and service punctuality".

They could very easily do that by running one train an hour - that would remove other distractions and hopefully ensure that that one train is reliable and punctual.

If reliability and punctuality are what they're after (and of course what they get penalised for screwing up), then don't expect any improvement in the number of trains running; they won't be restoring the number of trains that we used to have. That's not their focus. They're interested in running the bare minimum number of trains they can get away with, that are reliable and punctual so they don't have to make any refunds or pay any penalties.

I have no doubt that the Overground also has the same performance metrics - reliability and punctuality - so don't expect more trains there either, because it'll just screw up the measures they need to hit. And I bet they're already suffering due to Southern's incompetence - just this morning my Overground train was late due to the Southern train before it being late.

MightyMouse,
I take a slightly more optimistic point of view. If the news next week is bad for passengers then delaying 'Meet the Manager' would be a stupid thing to do. But then so would removing the tracks to three platforms at London Bridge without any sensible plans for making the signalling system work from day one.

Out of curiosity - how are the LB morning trains running at the moment?

I have changed my route so have not caught one for the past few weeks. However, I may need to for various appointments in the next fortnight.

Thanks

I've found the morning fine last 2 weeks. Been getting a seat on the LB trains even after 8. Train never gets in superfast (17 min). But far less sitting for 10 minutes. It probably takes 20-25 which is fine with a seat and is always better than the stress of the Overground.

Coming home I go another route unless it's after 7pm. Then I go LB and there's nobody on the trains. Always get a seat

The morning trains are fine, relatively speaking - no worse than they were last year and if anything slightly better, in my experience.

There do seem to be more commuters crowding onto the LO services at the expense of Southern, perhaps having been put off by the evening chaos.

There were always expected to be more people on the Overground service due to the lack of interchange to Waterloo and Charing Cross. The evening services are far too overcrowded as a result of half the trains from London Bridge being cancelled, and those that are running can be delayed and run slow.

Working in Waterloo, I'm happy to get the first train from Forest Hill whether it is going to Canada Water or London Bridge, either way I can change to the Jubilee line.

Coming home I need to decide where to alight the Jubilee line. Although it is tempting to get a seat on a London Bridge train, I always prefer the shorter walk at Canada Water, the much more frequent services, and the greater reliability. Obviously I'm not alone in making this calculation as the overground trains are packed.

If London Bridge trains were more than half-hourly, and were reasonably reliable, then I might be tempted back to the comfort of Southern trains.

The 9:12 was on time but then took 40 min to get to LB this morning.